Shaving myths

Discussion in 'Shave School' started by Engblom, Oct 8, 2015.

  1. tuxxdk

    tuxxdk International Penguin of Mystery

    I got my Mühle R89 (potato/potato!) 3 months in, so I'll take that as what I began with, never really liked my other first first that much.

    But to this day I still recon it's the best ever for me. Much alike my, now default, Weber razor. Similar head-design and gives marvellous shaves. But the shave-angle is different from most vintage ones.
     
  2. Engblom

    Engblom Well-Known Member

    I am a soap artisan, making soap. I fully agree you do not need tallow for a good shaving soap. However, as this myth is so very much ingrown in the community I want to comment a bit on this one.

    All soaps are made from three things: Fat or fatty acids, a fluid (water, glycerin, milk, whatever) and lye.
    Additionally they often contain fragrances.

    It is a two step reaction. First the fats react with a lye solution, and all the fats are split into fatty acids and glycerin. Then the second reaction takes place. In this reaction the fatty acids react with lye forming soap. When the reaction is complete we have soap and glycerin.

    Each oil and fat have a different fatty acid profile. Coconut oil got one that is very different from the one of tallow. This means that different oils and fats give different characteristics to the soap. Soap makers mix fats, oils and fatty acids to get the perfect end profile.
    Tallow is having naturally quite a bit of stearic acid, which makes the lather more dense and critical for a good shaving soap. Without a stearic acid source you can not get a good shaving soap.

    Now, you can buy the stearic acid directly, without having to use tallow for getting it. You can even buy fully vegan stearic acid, if you so like it. The only thing you need to make sure is to compensate with more glycerin as tallow was split into both stearic acid (and some other) and glycerin. If you put the stearic acid directly there, you never get the first reaction producing glycerin. Without glycerin the lather will dry way too fast.

    So, you can produce the exactly same soap without tallow as well with tallow, with the very same properties as long as you add both glycerin and stearic acid.

    The big soap producers are happily using tallow as it is a cheap product comparing with the alternatives. They have also refined their recipes during a long time so they produce good soap. Tallow gives more profit and their long experience is the reason to a better soap. That is maybe why often the tallow soaps are good.
     
  3. swarden43

    swarden43 "It's your shave. Enjoy it your way."©

    I try for BBS every time. Don't always get it, but I try. I know my limits and I take it there.
     
    wristwatchb and Weeper Warrior like this.
  4. Bymainer

    Bymainer Active Member

    Wait, you mean it's not! I'm feeling gullible
     
    Herm2502 likes this.
  5. Tallships

    Tallships Well-Known Member

    It all depends on the preference, how well and how many shaves a man gets from one particular razor weather it be Cartridge, DE, SE or Straight.
    From my own personal experience I've found traditional DE, SE wet shaving to be a long term savings compared to Gillette or Shick 5 blade Cartridge, $10.89 Fusion razor, Gillette Fusion 12 refill carts @ $40.99.
    A new Weber PH DE Razor $70 lasting better than 2o years = $3.50 per yr. @ 20 yr. or Gillette Slim I bought in 1960's has paid for it self. Years supply blades $18. So even if I only use my Weber for a year and Personna Reds @ $13 per 100, I'm saving money. This does not include cost of shave soap/cream, brushes, Aftershave etc. that is also used with Cart shaving.
    I have not tried Harrys or Dollar shave clubs , from what I hear is a great savings for those that prefer Cartridge shaving.
     
    SABOTEURw likes this.
  6. Tallships

    Tallships Well-Known Member

    That depends if you like a Blended or Single Malt or maybe a nice Bourbon Aftertheshave
     
  7. BamaT

    BamaT Well-Known Member

    I don't necessarily think it is the best razor ever; I'm not sure how anyone would ever reach a conclusion about that. But if the question were changed to how many of you that began with a DE 89 still like it a lot, I would certainly be in that camp.
     
    DrTerror likes this.
  8. DrTerror

    DrTerror Well-Known Member

    The DE89 might be a good shaver,but will it still be around in 100 years?.I prefer things that last,so no Zamak/pot metal razor 'floats by boat'.But obviously,if you are prepared to replace a DE every couple of years,go for it.My 34CHD lasted 12-13 months before a lump of chrome plate fell off for no reason,where as my part brass,part pot metal Vision 2000 is still going strong after 5 years,although it has had very little use.
    I have do have a pot metal headed Gillette Tech from 1974,but it was NOS,and has only been used twice since I got it 6 years ago!.
    I just wish all razors were made like they used to be,out of solid brass!.
     
  9. gzp

    gzp Well-Known Member

    It's still my #1 razor, others may be "as good" but none has been better. I find other razors tend to be less consistently good. I suspect that may be partly due to technique. Starting with it and using it exclusively for an extended period may have given it a significant advantage.

    I don't recall seeing it called "the best razor ever made".
     
    tuxxdk likes this.
  10. RaZorBurn123

    RaZorBurn123 waiting hardily...............

    Pot metal razors. Haven't heard that in a long time.
     
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  11. SABOTEURw

    SABOTEURw Active Member

    I don't think this is as much a myth as much as it's a matter of perspective.

    A not particularly new perspective either. (A similar debate exists concerning electronic cigarettes vs. traditional cigarettes) If you're on a limited budget, like myself, wet shaving WILL save you money because you can't afford to allow it to become a hobby.

    I purchased my razor for approximately $50. I've got 200 razor blades in my medicine cabinet I've spent less than $20 on. Using one blade a week, I have enough blades to last over 3 years. My soap use is negligible and my razor doesn't look as if it'll break down any time soon (see "Holy Grail" myth).

    I may be a newbie, but I think I can comfortably say (a) I won't need another razor and (b) I'm saving money through switching to wet shaving.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2015
  12. SABOTEURw

    SABOTEURw Active Member

    Last edited: Oct 11, 2015
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  13. Bymainer

    Bymainer Active Member

    Great link Saboteur- fun read
     
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  14. Eeyore

    Eeyore Well-Known Member

    Cartridges are evil
     
  15. 90quattrcoupe

    90quattrcoupe Well-Known Member

    I agree. I broke my Flare Tip back in the 80s, and went with the Trac II and then the Sensor. Never got past the 2 blade cartridge. I always felt that the cartridges were a little too much money, especially for the number of shaves I got out of one. I was even using old toothbrushes to clean the blades and cleaning with alcohol, to extend life of the blades. A few years ago while searching, I just happened upon on DE blades for sale. I pulled out my Mom's Red Tip and my Dad's SS and bought blades. I don't remember what make, but they gave me the same number of shaves as my Sensor and just as close. I am using the same soap my Dad and I used back in the 80s. Old Spice, Williams and canned Barbosal . Had the old soap for a while. I do use a newer brush from WD. I did have a Jagger(trying something new, but shaved the same as my Red Tip) so sold to a friend. I have bought a usable Fat Tech and Super Adjustable. I have passed on the Fat Tech, as the SA replaces the Red Tip for WTG and the Fat Tech for ATG. Still have the Red Tip and SS, since they belonged to my folks.

    So let's look at what it is costing me today to shave.
    I am using one razor, the SA Long Handle.
    Either old soap or canned goo, whether I was using Sensor or DE, so same cost.
    I am using either Astra SPs at about 10 cents a blade or Med Preps at $.25 a blade.
    Sensor blades are about $1.20 a cartridge.
    I am using the same aftershave, whether I was using a cartridge or DE. Nivea balm or Aloe 99. So same cost.

    So basically, for me, the only difference is the blade cost.

    I get let say 4 shaves(one WTG and one ATG pass) from either a Sensor Cartridge or a DE blades. 7.5 average blades or cartridges a month.

    Sensor cartridges 7.5 X $1.20 = $9 a month or $108 a year.
    Astras 7.5 X $.10 = $.75 a month or $9 a year.
    Med Preps 7.5 X $.25 = $1.88 a month or $22.50 a year.

    So over the last few years I have saved, just in the cost of blades, between $77 and $99 a year. This more than paid for the only razor I kept, the SA.

    I plan on buying some other razors to try out, only old school, but will only keep them if they shave the same or better than what I have now. I may buy replacements for what I have now, if I can find them with case, instructions, and original blades. But I will always be ahead of the game, because of blade cost. I will only buy what I use.

    Greg W.
     
  16. jeraldgordon

    jeraldgordon TSD's Mascot

    Some of these aren't myths! No, no, no! Say it isn't so!
     
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  17. richgem

    richgem suffering from chronic clicker hand cramps

    another myth: you can't teach an old goat new tricks.
     
  18. Gerry Canter

    Gerry Canter Member

    Yes. There's always a better razor out there ☺️
     
  19. crackstar

    crackstar Israeli Ambassador to TSD

    If I don't go against the grain on my second pass I can forget about a BBS shave.
     
    BamaT likes this.
  20. swarden43

    swarden43 "It's your shave. Enjoy it your way."©

    For me it's the third pass, but it is true that if I don't go ATG, I can forget about BBS. But that's me.
     
    youngunn, Kizurra and BamaT like this.

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