Hard to tell, at least in my limited experience. Is it an early sign? Possibly. I'd wait and hear from someone more experienced to chime in. Glen has dealt with this more than anyone i'm familiar with…. (@gssixgun ) Cell rot…. Usually one sees scale rot indicated by the effect of the gasses upon the blade: Best defense: keep it in a cool, dark and dry environment, keep your fingers crossed and check it often.
I do check them monthly I shaved with one today and I noticed it and checked my other one and it is worse I sent Glen picks he could not open the pics however using my description he said it sounds like it...it is strange both razors have it roughly in the same place scales are not cheap.
There is a reason why we call Cell Rot insidious.. First the pics of the scales really can't tell you much The steel on the razor is the definitive test You need to isolate the razor in a baggie closed for a few days, weeks,,, if a light rust or corrosion forms on the steel then it is Cell Rot for sure,, The real problem is that cell rot presents differently with the many different recipes of Celluloids It is really hard to diagnose cell rot without doing the tests I just personally finished doing the exact same with a DD Satinedge from a customer
From my limited experience, it seems certain vintage brands out there are more prone to it. You see a number of Dubl Ducks & similar razors with ruined blades from the cell rot. Even rarer, it seems, is any Otto Deutsch that doesn't show signs of rot…
I've somehow never heard of "cell rot" before. The staining to the celluloid looks similar to what happens with fountain pens that have been left in a drawer with an old ink sac installed. The lack of airflow and the gasses released from the deteriorating sac will cause permanent ambering of the celluloid. Old rubber tends to have a lot of sulphur, which is what I believe the pen experts say is the culprit.
You may not of heard of it but I guarantee you've seen it, especially if you peruse ebay's selection of 'quality' straights for sale... my favorite....not quite 'shave ready' condition....
Key search terms are Celluloid Rot Celluloid Disease Nitro Rot It is well documented among antique collectors, the off gassing is Nitric Acid or Acetic Acid Here is just one of 100's of article out there on various antiques http://vintagearchtop.com/celluloid.htm Also this explains some of the differences http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_stock here in this part All plastic is subject to deterioration through physical or chemical means, and thus, motion picture film is subject to the same deterioration. Cellulose nitrate, cellulose diacetate and triacetate are known to be unstable mediums: improperly preserved film can deteriorate in a period of time much faster than many photographs or other visual presentations. Cellulose nitrate, because of its unstable chemistry, eventually breaks down, releasing nitric acid, further catalyzing the decomposition. In the final stages of celluloid decomposition, the film turns into a rust-like powder. Likewise, tri-acetate stock is also vulnerable to deterioration. Because of the small gauge of the film, owners of home-made films often find that their film can become shrunken and brittle to the point where the film is unwatchable in the space of a few years. In general, decaying acetate film breaks down into Acetic Acid , and similar to celluloid decomposition, leads to an auto-catylictic breakdown of the base that cannot be reversed. The result of the acetic acid released is a strong odor of vinegar which is why the decay process in the archival community is known as "vinegar syndrome".
Normal rust yes,, This is Acid Vapor from the scales if it is cell rot I leave the blade in there unprotected and check it everyday, the worse the breakdown the faster the rust will appear.. Just to be clear for everyone reading.. There is NO cure, there is NO protection, if you have Celluloid Rot the scales are done for and need to come off the razor, the suspect razor needs to be isolated (quarantined) while being tested There are multiple stories out there of entire collections of not only razors but many other antiques being lost to Cell Rot.. ps: All Celluloid can breakdown even brand new stuff, I actually had to replace a custom set of scales for a customer because one of my suppliers sent me some "New" Celluloid blanks to test, so I used them and two weeks later the razor came back with a Frosted Rust layer...
Interesting read from an antique site regarding celluloid items: "The Oregon Knife Club’s website also notes that clear or light colored celluloid items appear to be more prone to this phenomenon. Why? It’s supposed that agents supplying the color to darker celluloid batches act as binding agents making the substance more chemically stable and thus thwarting, or at least slowing down, the deterioration process. If you have a collection of celluloid items, whether that translates into jewelry, knives, purses or razors, be sure to examine them from time to time to make sure that none are brittle or showing signs of cracking or flaking. If they are, it’s time to tell them goodbye for the sake of the rest of your collection. Pieces in good condition should be stored where they can breath. Also take care to keep them from touching to avoid transferring celluloid rot from piece to piece should that unfortunately crop up among a collection." Many of the items suffering from cell rot tended to be made prior to the 1940s—whether just coincidence, or there were simply fewer items being made of it post-1940, or other factors involved such as how these objects were cared for or stored.
I just read that same article, Kevin. As to the "prior to 1940's" question, it's because they developed better plastics during and following the war, so celluloid with it's various limitations and idiosyncrasies was cast aside. The flammability issue and a sensitivity to cleaning agents was always a weakness of celluloid, even when it was new. In case anybody here doesn't already know, never use rubbing alcohol to clean anything made of celluloid. It acts as a solvent and can ruin them. Anyway, I still quite surprised that I had never come across this before. I've collected vintage (mostly celluloid) fountain pens for 6 or 7 years, and no one ever mentioned this. There are many cases of celluloid that has turned yellow or brown as I described before, and warnings abound for the perils of using chemicals to clean them. I wonder if the rot just isn't as common of an issue for pens where the structural integrity of a small tube is maybe better than a flat slab. Also, the brittleness of celluloid is a big concern when you are restoring them, so you tend to handle them with extreme caution so as not to break them, and they were usually made with this in mind. Consequently, servicing them is aided by the design utilizing soft glues like shellac. Anyway, I digress. I think I'm gonna have to take a close look at my pens when I get home...
My personal theory is clear/light celluloid is sensitive to UV and heat. I won't buy cell scaled razors out of a flea market display case sitting in the sun cooking.
Well folks what ever it is it is not cell rot. I used hot soapy water and a nylon brush and then some "goof off" and it came off. Thanks for all who posted on this thread Take care.
Okay, so how exactly do you determine if the scales are celluloid, or some other material? Whether or not cell rot is present, should the scales just be replaced as a precaution?
I've done the "rub and sniff" test on the scales and no camphor smell. Is that the best way to determine if the scales are celluloid? Other than bone, horn and Bakelite (1909 and later?) what else was used? Are there different types of celluloid and is one less stable than another? So many questions!
