What ever happened with the budget stone runoff anyway? I'm looking for a budget option for a bevel setter and finishing stone. I had 3 mid grit stones I traded for but still need the book ends. Was hoping to get a 1k Christmas but the wife is sending off a straight for an overhaul instead. Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
A Cheap or Budget Bevel & Finishing Stone I Wouldn't Recommend..A 1 K Naniwa Pro Stone (Chosera) for Bevel Setting is Not Expensive & Probably the Best Bevel Setter Out there..A Naniwa 12 K Super Stone is a Fantastic Finisher & its Not Expensive Either.. Billy..
Everything is relative ;-) but those combine to be about 160-180 bucks Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
With the coticule you can set a bevel and dilute the slurry to finish, the other stones are intended as wetstones, to polish a shave ready knive a thad further. A friodur and an early carbon steal are a world apart, a wedge and a singing razors behalve different, the stropping changes,.... My advice: Get to know the stones, report your findings and realise that they apply to your stones with your knive and your way of handling. If, in 6 months or longer, you are stille interested in comparing a gold dollar from the stones,go ahead, but the you wil at least get the best out of the stones and the gold dollar. And people wilt learn a lot from your trial and error then ftrom, i did 10 laps on a gold dolar and it is still blunt
From everything that I've been reading, the person doing the honing is more important than the stone itself. A good 1k stone can give you something to shave with, and you can even vary that by the lubricants you use (water, kerosene, kerosene/mineral oil mix, mineral oil, heavier oil, etc) I mean, considering all the various 'razor hones' that were made out of synthetics back in the first half of the 20th century, they had to have WORKED. I suspect it was 'synthetic to hone, ceramic barber hone to maintain', for that period. I mean, my knives don't get sharper when I move from a 300 grit to a 1k grit. They just get smoother and more polished. I've even seen a couple of them stop being good knives, and only be good at cutting paper (really cleanly, though)
The honer is important. But I assume the honer will stay the same? So it is about the stones? But I have seen people test stones in the name of science. After the 12 or 16 k they do 10 laps on water and surprise surprise,... they hardly felt a difference,... So get to know the advantages and disadvantages of the hones. And i have 4 coticules, the are verry different, yet the are all typical coticule. And i shaved of my 1 k, it Works, and if I had no alternative, I would live with it. But I have alternatives, and in the old days the natural stones were available,... But expensive. Between a 300 and a 1000 I gain quite some sharpness and the 1k puts me at around 90 or 95 percent of the maxed sharpness of the razor and in general that is enough, but i lime it keener but buttersmooth.
Having honed just a few older Sheffield razors that haven't been touched since "Back in the day" let me tell you with no doubt at all, We expect, want, and get more from our edges now.. So many of the older blades are missing about 1 inch of bevel at the heels, they were just never set at all And trust me here, if the razors had issues like warps and a weak bevel the edges are even worse from "Back in the Day" Their idea of Shave Ready is nowhere near what we go for now days, During the Golden Age of SR's the idea of "Hair Tested" began to be a reality from the factories.. We started to se much more refined edges on SR's about the same time they were going out of business Looking back you can see why it was pretty easy to get people to switch from SR's to DE's after the turn of the century That is my opinion and what I have observed over the last 10 1/2 years of doing this professionally
Thats Bang on Glen..There Seems to be a Forum Taken for Granted Kinda Myth that "Back in the Day" Honing Skills were at their Peak & Mainstream..Most Blades I Get to Hone from the Golden Age of SRs the Bevel has Never Been Properly Set & the Heel Area Usually Always Needs Pulled in.. The Archaeological Evidence of Old Blades on the Hone Reveals All.. Billy..
For more empirical evidence, just look at the proliferation of the synthetic hones from the 10's through the 40's. They weren't being sold because there were better options - they were being sold because there was apparently a massive market need for reliable, predictable hones. I've sharpened an axe on cement. It doesn't mean that a file and real hone stone isn't better.
To Me a Consistent Hone is the Sign of the Better Hone when One has a Lot of Razors to Hone..A Modern Synthetic Progression is So Consistent & they are the Hones of Choice by Most Pro Honers these Days..A Natural Finisher & I have the Best of Both Worlds.. When the German Thuringian Hones Hit the Market they were Very Popular for the Same Reason..The Escher in Particular..Its Been Well Documented..To Me a Reliable Predictable Hone is the Dogs Danglies..Synthetic or Natural.. Nothing Seems to have Changed Mind Regarding Razors I Receive to Hone for Folks..There are Very Few of them Proper Bevel Set & the Bevel on the Heel Area is Typically Non Existent.. I Got a Brand New SR to Hone Just Last Week that the Guy Bought from a World Famous Custom Razor Maker & HoneMeister & it had Zero Bevel an Inch or More in from the Heel..I Find that One Very Interesting.. Billy..
Since the OP has disappeared and I love this type of contest I decided to have my own finishing stone Battle Royal. Shapton Glass 16k VS Suehiro Gokumyo 20k I picked out similar razors so I can compare the two. All of them have decent edges so I will take them all to a Naniwa SS 12k then either to the Shapton or the G20. I like the both stones and I think the G20 is a little smoother and the Shapton a little sharper, but now I want to find out for sure. In the mix: 2 Mastro Livi Grifetto, 2 Koraat, 2 Hart Steel, 2 PRC, 1 Wosty, 1 W&B, 2 J West and 2 Dovo
Round one of the finishing stone fight. I shaved with my Dovos and both edges were very smooth, I could not declare a winner in smoothness. The Shapton glass finished razor was a little bit sharper. Round 1 to the Shapton glass 16k, but it was very close.
Finishing stone tournament round 2 For round I selected 2 J West razors with similar grinds and styles, there both about 1/2 hollow and handle similarly. The Shapton finished razor was rough, actually I think it was user error on my part, this razor has always taken a fantastic edge. The edge was not horrible but below expectations. The Gokumuyo 20 razor was super smooth and sharp. This round goes to the G20 stone with easy. The score is now tied, 1-1.
I am more of a natural stone man but always understood the Shapton 30k gritsize was comparable to the sg 20k? I know people that use the 20k after the 16k Shapton,
Grit size is only one part of the equation Composition of grit Concentration of grit Type of binder, all these can affect the cutting power, and how the striations are cut and how deep they are cut, all that has an impact on the outcome Besides the input from the guy driving the razors across the hones
I don't believe that it's 'easier'. It's more that a synthetic stone is more predictable. The grit size is standardized, and the material composition is the same throughout. No inclusions, no layering.
It is easier at the lower stages, they are as @Bookworm mention straightforward and predictable or repeatable, my Naniwa SS 3k is the exact same as everyone else's etc: etc: Now at the higher stages / grits many of us use both Synthetic or Naturals, mostly depends on the "feel of the steel" I tend to finish each razor based on my experience with what I hear back from my customers over the last 10+ years For example, unless somebody requests a special finish, nearly every single Sheffield razor I send home is going home with a final finish from my Select Grade Coticule, why ??? because after 1000's of them I know that my customers prefer that edge, I get the most positive feedback from that edge on that steel from my hands Other razors I use other finishers that have proved to get me the best feedback on those types of steels. Now comes the "rub" Just because my Nakayama might get me great feedback on a TI does NOT mean your Jnat will, because they are after all Naturals and they vary.. But if I say for instance that on a NY Little Valley made Vintage that will hold the Shapton 30k edge and be SMOKING that means you should be able to do the same since your Shapton 30k is made the same as mine It really is all about feel and technique
