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Rockwell Owners Adjustable Razors Club (ROARC)

Discussion in 'Safety Razors' started by tuxxdk, Jun 8, 2016.

  1. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I would think that they will hold it within a few dollars for the initial release. How smoothly the rollout goes will play a part I'm sure, and if the razor has problems or not. I bet anyone who wants to will be able to get one at relatively the same price.

    If Parker gets their gap problems sorted out, or it turns out it was really nothing, that will likely help to keep the prices down a bit.
     
  2. sky pilot 83

    sky pilot 83 Active Member

    I'm interested heavily in the model T. I know they've been working on the design for well over a year, and i know all the problems they've had with manufacturers, and are having with the MIM process for the 6s which was their learning experience. I'm just hoping they finally catch a break and everything goes smooth for them.

    Sent from my Z936L using Tapatalk
     
    PickledNorthern likes this.
  3. Str8on2

    Str8on2 Well-Known Member

    I've had my Rockwell 6s for a little over a month and ran it for a full weeks worth of shaves. Paired with my favorite blade, the Kai it was very efficient. The first 4 plate settings really did not give me the feel I was looking for nor shave quality. But plate 5 and really 6 gave me a much better and smoother shave. Good weight and balance and the knurling was spot on. It's not as aggressive as I thought it would be and prefer even with the highest plate setting. Nonetheless, it's a good razor that provided very nice shaves.
    IMG_06261.jpg
     
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  4. Terry Williams

    Terry Williams Well-Known Member

    I got in on the 6C Kickstarter and ended up putting it in my travel kit. It's a bit lighter than the 6S, but it shaves very nicely. The bases don't seem at all different and blades that I like in the 6S feel the same. I'm happy with it. Got it in bright chrome and now thinking that gunmetal might have been more interesting. But, might get another. They're not too expensive. My sons can get the pass-downs. :)

    Looking forward to the Model T, though.
     
    sky pilot 83 likes this.
  5. nvpliers

    nvpliers Member

    And you can stick one in your travel bag. That's what I did.
     
  6. Str8on2

    Str8on2 Well-Known Member

    Excellent. The Model T looks very interesting. But, I have a couple tto's in my den, a Gillette Slim '63 and a Merkur Vision. I'm going to wait up on the Rockwell one a bit and see how they're received. Good luck...
     
    Terry Williams likes this.
  7. DesertTime

    DesertTime Well-Known Member

    Those are the choices I remember. What I don't remember is which one I ordered.
     
    PickledNorthern likes this.
  8. sky pilot 83

    sky pilot 83 Active Member

    So another step forward. On the model T. They're now doing stainless steel internals instead of the zinc or upgrade to brass. But another step backwards. Cast zinc head parts. It was announced 3 days ago... So now I'm back to not wanting one. On the bright side I've been using my second 6S lately breaking it in. I've discovered a huge difference between the new and old 6S razors. Both are version 2. But one that's been used a lot shaves a lot smoother than a brand spanking new one.

    Sent from my Z936L using Tapatalk
     
  9. tuxxdk

    tuxxdk International Penguin of Mystery

    Yeah I'm out too. Model T should be all stainless or I'm not interested one bit.
     
  10. sky pilot 83

    sky pilot 83 Active Member

    Stainless or a combo of stainless and brass.

    Sent from my Z936L using Tapatalk
     
  11. tuxxdk

    tuxxdk International Penguin of Mystery

    Yeah that would work as well. I don't mind brass, but zamak (realistic fear or not) I'd rather avoid. Especially at that premium price tag.
     
    sky pilot 83 likes this.
  12. sky pilot 83

    sky pilot 83 Active Member

    Yeah i mean the people i.e. the customer wants all stainless and or brass or a combo. They could've easily said "all stainless" and not one of us would've raised a ruckus even if the price went up 10-25 bucks. Why? Because we know what we want and are willing to pay for it. Right now they got the 6S, and the 6C. They could've easily done a model T in steel or a steel and brass combo, and another one much cheaper done in zamak. There's a market for both. I want quality so I'd buy steel. If i had a friend who was budget minded that zamak one would be another sale for them.

    I do not like zamak because of reviews I've read of pieces breaking, or the threaded post breaking off. I want an edwin jagger DE 86 OR 87 BUT that quality control issue has lead to an increase in complaints.

    Sorry about the detour in thought but this grinds my gears. I'm sittin here complaining and my sister is laughing thinking I'm nuts.

    Sent from my Z936L using Tapatalk
     
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  13. ninjack

    ninjack Well-Known Member

    Bummer! I was thinking of getting one, but not so sure now. Love my Gillette Slim Adjustables, still need to get a Fat Boy, too. The Model T looks nice, but not liking the zamak. Hope they find a way to make it from brass. Stainless would be fantastic! I won't get my hopes up.
     
  14. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I think it would have been worthwhile for Gareth to do a little more explaining of what parts were Zamak and why they want/need them to be used. It very well could be something that isn't a deal breaker, but because he glossed over it in an update, it is bound to be made into a worse case scenario on the web.

    It think when they made the change to brass internals it set a level of expectation that isn't going to be so easy to go back on. In my case, it really matters not. I have pretty much completely moved away from DE's; only used one once or twice since the end of last year. My plan was to sell it unopened as soon as I got it anyway. The delay was personally more disconcerting to me, just because I want to recoup my money, although I completely understand why they can happen. I also think that it may not be upsetting as many people as one might think. They had thousands of backers, and there hasn't been too much hubbub over it, so maybe it isn't that big of a deal to most folks. After all, Edwin Jagger and Muhle still sell razors as fast as they can make them.
     
  15. Terry Williams

    Terry Williams Well-Known Member

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    There are lots of razors with Zamak heads. I have a number of really old Gillettes (open combs) that have Zamak caps and they shave just fine. Only one (of about 5) has a threaded stem problem (brazing came loose). I think this came down to a business decision that would keep the project rolling. Otherwise, we would wait even longer. Assuming that I like it and I take care of it, then my son's can pass it down to their grandchildren. I, for one, am looking forward to receiving it.
     
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  16. DesertTime

    DesertTime Well-Known Member

    I don't have a problem with Zamak. My four razors, three adjustable and one fixed head, all use Zamak.

    I did find it curious that just weeks before Garret was praising the virtues of his new razor; its appearance and performance -- complete with videos. And in his February report announcing the switch, he did mention that all his pre-production units came out fine and the issue was with large-scale production.

    Obviously, to me at least, he can make the razors using the promised materials (we watched the videos), just not in mass-produced quantities. Producing the number of razors he needs to support his business model might be a problem using promised materials.

    I don't really have a problem with that -- I understand. I just feel he may have been a little disingenuous getting us to this point.
     
    PickledNorthern likes this.
  17. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I admit to full ignorance here, but can anybody tell me why the head? Is brass that much harder to work with? Is Zamak that much cheaper to buy and work with. If it is a tooling issue, the head would seem like an easy part to make. ( again, I have no idea) If it is a cost issue, did he promise mote than he could deliver for the pricepoint, and he's stuck because these are all pre sold?
     
  18. blashe

    blashe Well-Known Member

    The head is 4 parts, he cant just mail the razors to us all in zamak. There is bunch of people that has spoken regarding this issue and currently Gareth is shopping around for quotes for machined head parts. Probably bunch of people will go for the zamak heads, but for sure at least 50% of the pledgers want the all brass experience.... who knows he might get a good deal on SS machining so the whole razor will end up being SS, time will tell and we should know more in the next update. Although no matter what he will have to go with machined heads for the people that want that, its too many of us.

    I have to agree it was little funny how he posted in the last update, he said I just came back from the factory, everything is great and hey the head will be all zamak, cant wait to mail you your razors as soon as possible!!!! Hold your horses George, zamak you say? no way!
     
  19. Str8on2

    Str8on2 Well-Known Member

    I believe it's a combination of variables. Costs, tooling, metals used and production tolerances. Also the type of casting is a big factor in determining if his production goals and criteria are to be met. I believe Rockwell would be using a die cast production process called hot chamber die casting because of the high heat needed to cast brass. And I believe that's where some of their issues are coming from. Depending on the brass metal composition they are using and we can't know for sure, but some brasses have some difficulty in tolerating high temperature processes. And remember, they can't cast holes into the mold for the doors. They would have to wait for the parts to cool down, to then drill the tiny holes needed to insert pins and whatever assemblies needed to complete the process. In the end, it's more expensive to do it with brass. Zamak, or (Zamac) on the other hand is cheaper, molds to a lower temperature via cold chamber die casting and no drilling or grinding would be necessary since the holes can be molded into the die itself. And it can be massed produced much quicker than brass and contrary to what many believe, Zamak is stronger than Brass. Zamaks tensile strength is rated to just under 17,000 psi, as to for Brass is rated for just 8,000 psi or less. Brass is better in corrosion resistance, where as Zamak has to be plated to preserve it. I don't criticize their decision to change direction in production, things happen. It's just they waited so late to announce that they would be going in a different direction. I'm not a backer, but I feel for those who were and feel like they're getting the short end of the stick on this one.....
     
  20. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    Thanks. I am not anti Zamak, I just think it has an acceptable price range, and for me, $100 is well over that.

    Your explanation lends itself to the theory that it can't be done for the price point. We know it CAN be done. If it were just an issue of longer production time, that would only mean a delay, which is happening anyway. People who back these razors almost expect that, but he can't come back and ask for more money. Again, I don't especially care one way or the other, cause I'm not anxious to own it anyway; it would just be nice to recoup my money.
     

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