Based on feel when you hone?

I'm sure that depends on material and manufacturer, just like most everything.

I have silicon carbide and aluminum oxide hones. Some are cheap, others are high quality. (Norton Abrasives, for example). Crystolon is their brand name for Silicon Carbide, and India is the brand name for Aluminum Oxide. Silicon carbide removes material very fast, aluminum oxide less so. Grit size varies for both.

Most of my honing is knives, so it goes from high carbon steel to (more commonly) 420 and 440 stainless. That's it. Limited range of materials. I _have_ a couple of natural stones, but I've found that they're better for finishing, and it's a lot easier to clean up a crappy edge with the silicon carbide stones. Silicon carbide also works reasonably well to flatten other stones, but that's wasteful (It's a decent use for a dollar store hone - the ones that are dyed blue so they don't just look like a chunk of cement) My experience with sharpening, while done over a long period of time, is almost not translatable to straight razors. I mean, I guess I could put a good edge on one so you could use it for wood turning... but that defeats the purpose. So I can give information on hones, but less so on their usefulness for razors.

I just know that there was an explosion of 'razor hones' that were all synthetic a very long time ago - including my Norton Abrasives safety razor blade hone. My suspicion is that most of the (natural) sharpening stones men had were adequate for pocket knives and pen knives, but were either not large enough, or too expensive, to use on a straight razor and get a really good edge. Thus, people would hone the part of the razor they'd use regularly - leading to the heel problems mentioned earlier. So, when the synthetics came out, they pitched them at the razor owner. "Look, it's a hone that's actually long enough to get a full stroke, and wide enough to encompass the entire blade if you have it angled, and you can afford it!"

So far I find the Shapton glass 16k and the Gokumo 20k to be very similar, the Shapton feels a little sharper while the G20 a little smoother. That’s what inspired me to compare them.

For someone with my skills synthetics are easier, I have a Zulu Grey and J Nat. Sometimes I get a great edge from a natural and some times I don’t. With a synthetic 90% of the time a get a great edge. It also takes allot less time with the synthetics.

I've accumulated a fair number of natural stones over the years, most of them dirt cheap and most will fit in a progression someplace. Finding a good natural finisher(s) has been more problematic. I find alot that are close but no cigar. So I have a Thuri, Celebrated Water Hone, 3 coti's, 2 will finish a blade nicely the other is faster and will get you almost there and a Charnley Forest (not cheap but not bad) and a few of the harder Arkies. All of them will finish with the exception of the one coti. No way I'd get rid of my synthetics. At a minimum I'd want to keep my 1k, Norton 4-8k combo and either some lapping film or a 12k. I would like to try a few of the higher grit synthetics but it's not a priority.

Where does one find an affordable Coticule or is there such a thing?

I'm getting started honing and have a 1k naniwa chosera on its way. I also traded for 3 natural stones from a forum member but I have heard so many talk so highly of coticules and jnats as finishers. I knot jnat is out of the question so Im curious is there an affordable coti?

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If you are using the Coti as a Finisher you most certainly do NOT need a large stone so you can hunt for a smaller size to save money

Keep in mind many of these Naturals earned their reputations back when they prices where MUCH lower

To give you an idea

Back in 2007=2008 Norton 4/8' were $63
8x3 Coticule Select Grade was about $100
2x8 Escher's in any color were $125
J-nats of awesome provenance could be had for $150
Charnly's, ToS, WoA, Dragon Tougues were no more than $75

When people ask me today if they should buy a $700 Escher because they heard it is way better than a Naniwa 12k I tell them they are smoking crack, even at $400 they are simple not that much better

But yer money, yer face, your choice Good Luck

For €100 euro you buy a 100x4cm coticule with slurry stone in a wooden box straight from the mine,...
The used ones go cheaper.

I got 3 Welsh slates for €30 from aj on eBay

My yellow green Esher was €260 on eBay

My ozuko5+, yae botan, botan, tenjou, mejiro, koma and a nice tomonagura were around €450,....
C.f was €80

I even got a very nice coticule for free with a cheap second hand knive,..

So you can spend about anything on natural stones. If you fancy a sg20k you can pay full price or wait until someone gets bored with his stone,...


I think that using synthetic hones in the low grit range and naturals in the higher range makes a lot of sense as advice. After my 1,2,5k synthetics I can go to all my natural stones and get an easy sharp, comfortable edge.
And if feel like it ( I mostly do) I can go from bevel to finish with the jnat or the coticule,..

I've been lucky. Ive not paid more than $7.50 a piece for any of the 3 coti's I have and they're older than dirt but in good shape. They're small but a little larger than the size of a Celebrated Water Hone that comes in the flip top box. Pretty much the same for the Thuri and the Celebrated Water Hone. My CF cost about $125 and if I ever get a Escher it will be found in the wild and a good deal. I really don't need anything for maintaining an edge but unfortunately I like to experiment and I'm impulsive, bad combo.

The Welsh Slate Stones, from AJ, are my first finishing stones, and I have used them on over 100 straights. They aren't for everyone, because they are slow cutters, but they do a fine job, once you figure them out. I also use an Arkansas Surgical Black as an Ultra Finisher.

I think your keyboard spat a hairball there.

Stupid Kindle. Corrected now.

Finishing stone run off round 3

This round featured Hart Steel, the big 7/8 was finished on the Gokuymo 20k and the 6/8 on the Shapton glass 16k. The Shapton edge was very smooth and very sharp while the G20 edge was just smooth and very very sharp. This was the biggest difference between the stones yet, the Shapton was a lot smoother and the G20 a lot sharper. I would have declared it a tie but based on the shave results the winner of round 3 is the Shapton glass, it is now 2 vs 1.

Irritation A+ Closeness A Smoothness A+ Sharpness A+

Razor: Hart Steel 6/8 (S16)
Stop: T Miller
Brush: Rooney
Pre: Proraso
Soap: Tabac
AS: Spieck AS, L’Occitane ASB
Scent: Chanel Antaeus

Irritation A+ Closeness A- Smoothness A Sharpness A+

Razor: Hart Steel 7/8 (g20)
Stop: T Miller
Brush: Elite Razor Manchurian
Pre: Nivea
Soap: Tabac
AS: Spieck AS, L’Occitane ASB
Scent: Chanel Egoïst

Well that's all way out of my price range. Maybe the better question is what to look for? I'm always in antique stores and see stones but don't always know what I find. I have seen a stone or two I thought was a coti but they werent much bigger than a deck of cards.

Main thing I want is a good finisher and if I can find something at a budget id prefer it as Im still new and I'm not doing it for money just to hone my own razors.

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One of the best Coti I have ever seen and honed on is the "Deep Rock" they are about 2.5 x 4 and thick

You really have to do the research if you are going to look for rocks in the wild as they can really be deceiving

1 micron lapping film can be had for a few bucks. Actually PM me your address and I’ll send you a couple sheets gratis.

Some Thuringian Stones these Days are Goin for Super Crazy Money in the USA in Particular..In the UK You Can Pick them Up a Lot Cheaper..The Escher Ones Fetch Super Daft Money..The Thuringian I have above was Not Labeled So I Am Not Sure what it is 100 %..I Have Been Informed its an Escher Due to the Light Colors..

This One has a 16 K + Finishing Capacity Very Easily..That Said..I have Bought & Shave Tested a Number of Thuringians from UK EBay Including a Labeled Escher Thuri..They were All Around 12 K Finishing Capacity..One was Perhaps Less than 12 K..No Where Near the 16 K + of My Stone..So..There Certainly is a Wide Variation in Finishing Capacity of Thuringian Stones..Without a Doubt..

A Naniwa 12 K Super Stone is Grit Rated Yeah..But..Less Spoken about in Forums is that High End Grit Rated Synthetic Hones in the Right Hands have a Higher Finishing Capacity than their Grit Rating..I Reckon a 12 K Super Stone Can Knock Out a 14 K Edge..No Problem..1 Micron = 16 K Lapping Film has the Finishing Capacity of 20 K ..When Worn 20 K +..

As Far as the Width of a Stone Goes..I Personnaly Dont Find Any Difference in One Way or Another..My Coticule above is a Very Narrow Stone..I Find it as Easy to Use as a Naniwa Super Stone..

Billy..

Lapping film is a good way to go, IMO. It's close to fool proof as you can get and will finish well.

About the width of the stone, the more geometrical problems a razor has, the more i prefer a narrow hone.

I read a few times that in the old days, a hone for razors was convex to cope with geomtrical problems

Round 4

I finished my PRC western grind kami on the Shapton 16k and my PRC Damascus on G20. While not the same steels, good enough from my non scientific test. The edges are very similar, I gave a slight edge to the Shapton again, they were both very smooth and very sharp with Shapton just tiny bit sharper.

Can you teach me how to use a BBW and. Coti instead ? I was at a local antique mall and came across a BBW and Coti and grabbed them both. I tried to finish an edge on a razor with the coti and must have missed the mark because it was actually less sharp than before I tried it.

Thank you for the kind offer!

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