2020 is definitely the year of the Gillette Slant

Discussion in 'Safety Razors' started by PLANofMAN, Jun 22, 2020.

  1. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    @Droo78 correctly guessed the answer to my riddle in the clockwork razor thread.

    @twhite was kind enough to offer his assistance when I approached him about doing a side project.

    One of the things that vexes all collectors of vintage razors is the number of old razors with bent teeth. The general consensus is that if they don't affect the shave, don't mess with them, as you are likely to break your razor's teeth off.

    After carefully researching the matter, I believe that the teeth in most cases can be saved by annealing the brass, and by following a few other steps, which will be detailed in an article I've already written, but not yet published.

    I haven't published it yet, because I don't know if it will actually work. Tom volunteered to make me a jig to see if the process works. Both of us think it ought to work, but the chances are we will wind up with lovely slant razors with no teeth.

    The jig will fit any (or at least most) Gillette style brass three piece open combs with centering posts. This would be the type with a handle and separate base plate and top cap, not the types with the handle mated to the baseplate.

    So, Gillette old types, German copies, and the German 'travel razors' will be the candidates for this iteration of the jig.

    Droo78's reward will be a free slantification of any of those kind of razors (if the project works) If you don't have one, those razors can be fairly inexpensive ($20-30), especially when compared to vintage open comb slants.

    Assuming all this works, you might have to get it replated as well, since the heat required to anneal a brass razor head is very close to the heat required to melt the plating.

    Both Tom and I have chipped in a razor to test it out first, so you won't need to worry about me destroying your razor.

    Edit: I don't foresee turning this into a money making venture. Most likely I will do some in my spare time, and do some conversions for Den members. If Tom and I are able to do this successfully, I'll probably end up giving it to Matt at Razor Emporium, and let him deal with it, since he has the facilities to restore the finish on these razors. Maybe Tom and I can score a free replating service or something for it, or $1 per razor royalties for each of us. :p
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2020
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  2. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    I almost forgot. Why am I doing this? Well, this all goes back to my quest for a unicorn razor. Early in my wet shaving journey, I tried a Hoffritz slant, and it gave me the worst shave I've ever gotten from a razor. I've since shaved with one other that was even worse than that, but that's neither here nor there.

    I vowed to not try slants again until I was able to pick up an elusive brass open comb slant. Vintage options were a very early Merkur OC slant (I've seen a picture of one) or a Merkur made OC slant for Abercrombie & Fitch, back when they actually were expedition outfitters, and not a semi-trendy fashion brand for rich teenagers. (I've seen two of those). After about 10 years, I discovered the French made Valencia Slants, and was able to aquire one. @efsk owns all the others that exist in the world, and you can't convince me otherwise. :p

    What I discovered, was that the Valencia gave me one of the best shaves I've ever had. It's both mild and very efficient. Since the Valencia pretty much shares the same geometry as a Gillette Single ring, I figured that a Gillette old type would be the perfect candidate for 'remanufacturing.' Old types are both very common and usually inexpensive, compared to other vintage Gillette razors. Of the old Gillette razors, the only ones that are usually cheaper than old types are techs and superspeeds.

    So there you have it. The inspiration for this project.

    Edit: @twhite was supposed to try the Valencia for himself this weekend. He's been rather mum on the subject. Maybe he'll share his impressions of the shave with us soon?
     
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  3. jmudrick

    jmudrick Type A Man

    Do you have the new Fatip slant? My favorite slant by a lot. Of course don't know about your Valencia.

    Sent from my LG-US998 using Tapatalk
     
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  4. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    I meant to mention that one. Fatip was approached by a member of B&B, and was asked to consider making slant versions of their popular closed and open comb models of razor. They did so, and so there is one current production brass open comb slant on the market right now. It has been getting quite good reviews from those who like slants.

    I have not used it, but I was aware that they are out there. From what I understand, they are more aggressive than the valencia, even though they are not slanted as much as the Valencia.

    The Valencia's slant is sometimes called a double torsion helical slant, or a 'superslant.' @efsk is far more knowledgeable than I when it comes to slants. He has used both and can probably give you a better answer than I. If I remember correctly, I think he said that the Valencia was the smoother shaver, but that the Fatip was no slouch either.

    Edit: the Fatip bends the blade on a diagonal plane. The Valencia bends the blade on both a diagonal plane and a linear plane as well. When compared side by side, the Valencia has more drop or droop. I'm not explaining this very well am I?

    The Valencia is curved on a diagonal from the corner of one blade edge to the opposite corner of a blade edge. It also 'drops' in the lower corners, which flexes the blade from the unsharpened edge to the other unsharpened edge. It adds just a bit more twist on a slightly different angle. This gives the blade a lot more rigidity than some other slant designs. In some ways it shares more in common with a shake sharp razor than it does to other slants, notably the rigidness of the blade.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2020
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  5. brit

    brit in a box

    AWESOME..:)
     
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  6. Droo78

    Droo78 Well-Known Member

    That sounds fantastic! Such a great idea. I have an extra Old Type head already that would be a candidate. It came in a razor lot and had a Tech handle attached. It has two slightly bent end teeth too I believe.
     
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  7. Jayaruh

    Jayaruh The Cackalacky House Pet

    Supporting Vendor
    Subscribed...
    very-interesting-2 .jpg
     
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  8. efsk

    efsk Active Member

    @Cha-wing!! has quite a few Valencia as well, but between us, we're getting close to the entire production :happy093:

    The original slant patent basically described a slice of a helix, so an edge that was curved in two ways: up-down and end-to-end. The idea was that you'd get the guillotine cut, but the varying angle-exposure-gap-combination you'd get along the edge would make for equal aggression/efficiency all along the cutting edge. (see https://razors.click/patents/GB191403504/) What you describe with the Valencia is exactly that. You can see similar on Fasan for instance, or Krect, and quite a few others.
    Fatip and others basically tilted the cutting edges, and then did something with the cap to make sure exposure was even ("even" used here losely, as this is Fatip ;)). Makes for a different shave. I believe the Valencia is more aggressive than either Fatip slant, however if you get the hang of the razor, it will deliver you the most comfortable fabulous shaves imaginable. The Fatip can get you great shaves as well, where with my pair the OC was better than the CC, however is more of a kind. IMHO it doesn't add much compared to Merkur 37, or the Parker slant (basically a 37 head).

    As for the term double slant: this is seen on the Fasan shippers: Doppelschräg or Double Tilted. I believe that was used to differentiate from "single tilted" heads such as Walbuch or Mulcuto, where. like with the iKon 102, the head was placed on the handle in an angle. Fasan basically said: we've tilted it both ways. This, combined with the red dot on later models, has led to the misinformation that Fasan have differential aggression: they don't. The dot is to help identify blade edge, they had an entire instruction on how to use and turn a blade to get the most of it.
    Later on the forums the term double slant was used for the Merkur/Hoffritz extreme slant, only to describe how slanted this head was: twice as slanted as a regular 37.
    So, the Valencia is double slanted according to Fasan-terminology, but an "ordinary" slant as per the Wilde patent linked to above.

    I'll be following your project.
     
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  9. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    Here's Tom's report on the slant:
    Update on the progress of this project from Tom:
    "I also have the layout of the slant die. I will try and cut it this week. That way I can try one of my razors this weekend."
     
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  10. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    IMG_1594739482041.jpeg
    Progress report. :) the base of the die is almost done. Tom does some really nice work, yes?
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
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  11. Tjebbe

    Tjebbe Well-Known Member

    Nice progress!
     
  12. ischiapp

    ischiapp New Product Bloodhound

    What a twist!!!
    :happy093:
     
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  13. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
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    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
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  14. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    There's some good news and bad news. The bad news is that this was originally proposed to figure out how much heat was needed to anneal razors enough to bend them, and to further the study of fixing bent razor teeth. In that task, ladies and gentlemen, we have failed miserably.

    Turns out, that since you are bending the head, and not the teeth, no heat is required, and not much pressure either.
     
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  15. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    IMG_1594827504196.jpeg
    Cosmo German old type travel razor (top)
    Gillette 102 old type (bottom)
    IMG_1594827710749.JPEG
    IMG_1594827757849.JPEG
    IMG_1594828060863.jpeg

    Tom will be comparing this Gillette to the Valencia tonight, and possibly be reworking the die tomorrow.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  16. Droo78

    Droo78 Well-Known Member

    That looks excellent! :happy088:
    I look forward to the shave review.
     
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  17. efsk

    efsk Active Member

    Utterly cool!
     
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  18. brit

    brit in a box

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  19. jimjo1031

    jimjo1031 never bloomed myself

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  20. twhite

    twhite Peeping Tom

    [​IMG]
    Shave 1 in the books.
    Razor: @PLANofMAN Gillette Slant
    Blade: GSB
    Brush: JR250
    Soap: Palmolive Stick
    AS: Florida Water

    Take away. This was a REALLY NICE shave. It was so smooth that you want to stop and see if you forgot the blade smooth. It was also a quiet shave. This told me no blade chatter. So the Torque instilled on the blade works.

    I will do some minor adjustments tomorrow on the jig. Then get it out to Ryan. Then he can play with it for a while, then get back to me with mods if he sees fit.
     
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