So here's the deal. I've been shaving with straights for years and have recently been dabbling with DE. With a straight, I easily get a DFS/BBS without irritation with two passes with any well honed straight made with quality steel. Since dabbling with DE, I find any combination of razor blade results in the same net shave: irritation along my lower neck line. Slim set at 1. Slim set at 9. Blackbird. ATT M1. With Astras, GSB's, Kai's, et. al. I can shave the rest of my face with any DE and any blade darn near, and get DFS and zero irritation, but any combo of razor/blade irritates the heck out of my lower neck line. I've been super conscious of blade angle and pressure since this has manifested, but to no avail. My DE prep is the same I use with a straight; hot shower, wet my face, lather and go. Since experimenting with DE I've tried a couple of pre-shaves (JB Beard Lube and my own home rolled pre-shave oil I concocted when I first started wet shaving) with no real improvement. "Kyle's Prep" afforded no improvement for my lower neck line. My straight technique is very good. Irritation free shaves 100% of the time. But this lower neck line irritation with DE is giving me fits. Why trouble free with the straight, but the irritation with the DE? Also, I get great irritation free shaves with a Feather AC shavette just to add another variable/complication. Any ideas for continued trouble shooting are much appreciated! Thanks!
If you like SR and Feather shavettes, maybe you should try a Feather New Hi Stainless Steel DE blade. They are the sharpest around.
I do have a tuck spooled to try. Just tried a Vokshod which was up next in my sampler. Same result on my lower neck line. A comfortable, mild blade, but one that required multiple passes with buffing on the balance of my face to get what a GSB for example would have erased in a pass. Perhaps a super sharp blade like the Feather is more suited to my needs, a sharp bade requiring minimal passes. After one WTG pass on my lower neck, anything additional is only going to irritate I think. As DaltonGang alluded to, the problem doesn't seem to be one of blade sharpness, it's more likely my OCD in chasing a better shave with multiple passes.
I went from DE to straights and can get a great shave from both except for mild DE. Mild DE razors have a very narrow window for an effective angle while an aggressive DE offers a wide range of angles that cut, similar to a straight razor. Try an agressive DE and 'ride the cap' per @Bama Samurai. If you ride the cap then you adjust your angle similar to a straight. Ironically mild razors give me the most difficulty and usually end in irritation but without a close shave.
Tomorrows shave will be a Toro Mastiff with a new Feather. About the most aggressive thing I have at the moment, short of cranking a Slim wide open. I've been tippy-toeing with an ATT-M1 and a Blackbird the last few days, perhaps a more aggressive head with a sharp blade will give me the closeness with fewer passes (1 or 2) I'm seeking in more passes (3-4) with milder razors. I did read through the "Riding the Cap" thread. My angle is always: minimum I can maintain while keeping blade contact with the skin and still cut whiskers. This by proxy results in really riding the cap at a shallow angle. I rely heavily on blade feedback, comes naturally after straight shaving forever. I did notice tonight that the M1 head on the ATT (with a Vokshod) isn't giving me near the feedback I like in a blade...
Trying increasing the angle and the aggressive level when shaving with a DE. I start at the minimum and angle and then increase the angle until I get the 'feel' and sound I am looking for, similar to using a straight. Since you are a straight shaver do not be afraid to use a more aggressive and angle and shave by feel.
Thanks for all the encouragement and helpful technique stuff when I was learning SR. Still using a shavette most of the time! SR maintenance was something I'm not interested in doing at this time, but love the open blade shave! Done about 400+ since we last exchanged posts.
Good work! DE's are a whole new ballgame to me! I went from disposables to straights and bypassed DE all together, so the chickens are coming home to roost! After an out of state move in January, all my hones were still packed away and I just became too lazy to find the box and hone my straights and wound up resorting to my Feather DX. One day on a whim about two weeks ago, I decided to give an old Schick Krona a spin, and got a really nice shave from it, nice enough to spawn an interest in trying more DE's. Fun learning new stuff, even if my neck is paying the price! Honestly, I had been kind of phoning it in with my straights for a bit, and was looking for new worlds to conquer. DE's are challenging in new ways, and the freshness is fun. I have high hopes for the Toro Mastiff/Feather combo. If it works, I can see an R41 and an ATT H2 plate in my future...Thank goodness DE RAD is soooooo much less expensive than SR RAD.
The report after the Toro Mastiff/Feather combo... Still irritated. However, I feel like the irritation is less than it would have been with a less aggressive, less sharp razor/blade combo. The combo felt good and the Feather is super sharp, to the point of being harsh. I'll take the next new Feather I use for a quick 5 or 10 passes on the strop before use. I think the GSB is very nearly as sharp, and seems to be a bit better feeling on my face. In fairness, now that the irritation has reared its ugly head, it may be necessary to go back to straights for a week or so to let my face recover and take a clean swing at the DE side.
Odd that it only seems to be an issue on the lower neck line. I suspect you may have differing hair growth patterns in that region, making it highly susceptible to irritation, and the use of a DE razor has merely exacerbated the condition. Others here have already offered suggestions regarding angle, pressure and the type of aggressiveness of the razor to be used. I hope one or more of these you find helpful in alleviating the discomfort. It may be a situation that can only be truly resolved by sticking with the straights as they seem to provide you the desired results. Since we're not there to rub your face (hows that for a creepy thought?) to know whats really going on wth your whisker growth, I'd have no qualms with saying: stick with the straights! Or grow one of these! Neck irritation solved!
I do not recall giving my permission to use my photo Historically (before straights), whenever I get some razor burn, it's always in this same location, port side lower neck. The beard does grow in at a different angle in this location, but I've always simply modified my angle of attack to compensate. This almost certainly plays into the irritation, somehow. Oddly, this is a non-issue with straights, and was one of the main factors in my becoming a straight shaver in the first place. This could simply be an issue where straights simply work better for me. The difference in post shave face feel is substantial. EDIT: In a Eureka moment just now, its occurred to me that I should try using a straight for this troublesome lower neck area and shaving the balance of my face with a DE...just for yuks...
Your probably a pro at stretching the skin in the tender area when using straight razor. However, when using a de, the stretching gets left out. The soft skin sorta folds over and tugs, ending up in little nicks. Bottom line, try a bit of stretching the skin while shaving this area. Also the att m1 is so very mild it's easy to overshave.
Your observation about stretching is very, very true in this case. In a mental "lessons learned" from the shave that this irritation issue arose from, I recall thinking that I wasn't paying due regard to skin stretching...a relic of my straight shaving habits. I'd been successfully simply angling my neck for a straight razor pass and long ago quit using my free hand to stretch the skin. A good reminder that familiarity with one technique can breed contempt for another and result in a failure to follow the fundamentals. And yup, the M1 plate is a goner, on it's way back to Maggard tomorrow, it's simply not a good fit for me.
Let you skin heal so 'residual' irritation is not an issue. I find the Feathers harsh in aggressive razor and usually go with a GSB or Iridium Super.
+1 on pretend you are straight shaving. Stretch big time, and just do it. @david of central florida - good point
Well, for whatever combination of reasons, I'm getting great DE shaves now with very, very minimal irritation at my troublesome lower neck line. Things I'm doing differently than those first few shaves: -I've gone back to my simple "shower then hot water splash" on face for prep. -I'm being very conscientious to stretch my neck skin while shaving low. -I'm shaving one pass ATG only along my lower neck, and resisting the temptation to get BBS there. The pass feels comfortable while shaving, it's only after shaving I may still get a wee bit of redness. Alum and a simple AS splash, and 10 minutes later it's gone and forgotten. Also, advice given here to simply approach the shave as I would a straight shave may be the Grand Key to the whole thing. I'm way less focused on concentrating on watching angles in the mirror and way more in tune with simply going with how the edge feels best and most efficient on my face. I'm a huge advocate of "Zen Shaving", and frequently give this advice to new straight shavers. It turns out it's very applicable to DE shaving as well .
