Old-Type is difficult to shave with but the best post-shave BBS experience.

Discussion in 'Safety Razors' started by Tim Spencer, Jun 25, 2017.

  1. Bama Samurai

    Bama Samurai with Laser-like Focus Staff Member

    Moderator
    If a razor feels rough it's because the user is employing an improper angle of attack and scraping the skin. It's all technique related. A DE blade is a DE blade is a DE blade. Truly master angle and pressure...all razors are smooth because they all use the same blade edges.
     
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  2. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    It shaves, therefore it is.
     
  3. Tim Spencer

    Tim Spencer Well-Known Member

    Hmm,

    So, the Kai isn't .006 inches but rather .004? I swear there is a HUGE difference in my shave experience. I used the exact same technique with far less irritation on the Old Type.

    I'm also testing the Kai blade today in another razor that usually tears up my face (Dave Ocean 33 "Atlas"). I'm hoping the Kai does as well in this as it did in my Old Type.

    Also, on a side comment, the Kai blades appear to my naked eye to seem thicker, which could just be my imagination because that's what I was expecting. Rigidity may play a role then. Regardless, if it works, it works. I'll continue to test with the Kai blade and hopefully the results I got with the first use remain the results when I repeat the shave.
     
  4. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    I've been observing this thread for a couple of days. I have but one comment;
    Aren't we overthinking this whole razor blade thing just a tad, hmmm?
     
    jmudrick likes this.
  5. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    Uhh.. We're in a forum dedicated to people who are obsessed with shaving in one form or another - specifically with non-disposable options. I'd say it's inevitable.

    @Bama Samurai - with all due respect, they're not all the same. It may be the steel, it may be the honing process (or lack thereof), but there are differences in blades. The reason there are so many different blades is that people have different faces. With the same razor, same technique, same soap, but three different blades, I get three different results. Dorco is a fight to get a good shave (I get it anyway). Derby is so-so on the face, but great elsewhere, and Astra SP was really easy to work with. Same razor, same technique, I'm having great results with the LORD blade - 8 shaves and counting so far. Shark was good as well. Nacet fantastic. Voskhod ended up binned halfway through a shave.

    However, I know there are lots of people that hate Sharks, love Voskhod, like Derby, and I personally know someone that really likes the Dollar Store Dorcos. I don't have a good microscope to do full out tests, but I suspect that the grind on the end is slightly different in the finishing stage for various razor blades. I don't believe that the coatings on the blades make much difference, once you add _any_ coating.

    What I do believe you're correct on is that good technique will allow you to get a decent shave out of even bad blades, without severely injuring yourself. (As long as the blade isn't corroded. I managed, but that hurt)

    Oh, yeah - the Hong Long felt rough, but most of that is that double the side width was exposed, and the angle was bad (and couldn't be fixed), so the blade edge bounced around like a turkey on a trampoline. That's a pure "Blame the tool and the tool maker."
     
  6. Bama Samurai

    Bama Samurai with Laser-like Focus Staff Member

    Moderator
    This is a case of "you don't know what you don't know."

    Different razors present different levels of aggressiveness in their geometry. This necessitates adjustment to grip and attack approach angle, and will change how a blade behaves. Many new converts, however, don't account for this, and change blades or razors looking for a smoother or more efficient shave. Many guys, like you, encourage this, and it retards the learning curve of newer people.

    You've battled me often over "all razors are the same." They are indeed. Do blades differ slightly? Sure, but not enough to foil an expert.

    People need to stop the equipment argument insanity and master their tools. A DE blade is a DE blade.

    All razors are simply a handle for moving a soap lubricated razor bevel at a 20-25 degree angle in a path parallel to the skin bed. You can focus on radial curves and blade changes until time immemorial, and you'll miss the above key point. You'll not find a vintage style razor that violates this postulate. If a modern safety razor gives a rough shave, it's technique, and almost always angle and pressure. People need to get real about this. We have guys on this forum who can staple a DE to a stick. Why is that? It's called skill. You can tell people anything you feel about why you get bad shaves with some equipment, but if you aren't saying "It's because I lack the skill and familiarity with this razor model", you're probably wrong about your shave results.

    If there's an issue with the blade at skin level, it's almost universally caused by technique. It's why Straights and Shavettes are truly and actually the most gentle shave out there, because anything less than near ideal technique results in blood. Old style SE and injector are next best. As safety measures on razors developed, it made fine motor skill almost obsolete for shaving, and the toll was extracted in user comfort.

    It's all about angle and pressure. You can dress that razor bevel up, and argue over tires (blades) and training wheels (DE design) all you like. It's all nonsense, and it doesn't give new converts a real idea of what's possible. The results very largely depend on the skill level of the user, and no razor designer can ever hope to change that. If someone has mastered the interaction of angle and pressure, safety bars are essentially non functional anyway, as shaving is about bevel control. Otherwise, guys who BBS with DE shavettes are lying to you, and SR shaving is impossible because it's to "aggressive."
     
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  7. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    Thank you Chris!!
    We now return you to your regularly scheduled Rule/Focus.
     
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  8. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    The first week of blade auditions for my 1911 OLD is in the books. The Gillette Silver Blue acquitted itself in its usual exemplary fashion. Out of six shaves, two BBS and the rest DFS or DFS+. Shark Super Chrome is up come Sunday.
     
  9. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    :signs011:
     
  10. wchnu

    wchnu Duck Season!

    Somehow I have missed the last comments in this thread. Not sure how I did that.

    Yup. That is the simple answer. A dollar store Dorco will shave as good in an OLD as a Feather.

    That is one of the best statements ever.

    All the different blade stuff is window dressing and hype for the most part. I use uncoated blades all the time. They do not get stuff stuck all over them. Different grinds and such are hype. Look at straight razors. A wedge shaves as good as a hollow ground once you know how to use a razor.

    Thicker blades thinner....who cares. They still come down to a edge that is sharp. I have never had a blade flex and not shave good.....and I never shim a blade. I use SE...Injector..DE..Straight..and.......Shavette type razors. All give great shaves once you learn the technique.
     
  11. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    That isn't a good comparison. I haven't tried a Feather, but while I can get a decent shave from a Dorco, I can get _better_ shaves from better blades.
     
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  12. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    Blade thick, blade thin, micrometer, microscope :prrr:
    Does it shave ya good or doesn't it?
     
  13. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    Dorco? It shaves. The hair is gone with no cuts. It's not 'good'. Same with Derby. Astra SP, the LORD I just finished, Shark - those are 'good'. Nacet and Rapira Platinum Lux were 'really good'. I think that the better brands have a better quality control on tracking hone wear, or just an additional honing step. Much like the straight razor folks who say you can get a shave ready edge on a 1k stone - and then go on to the higher grits. Just because it's shave ready doesn't mean it's going to be as much fun :)
     
  14. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

     
  15. wchnu

    wchnu Duck Season!

    Yup I get equaly good shaves from any sharp blade. You will to.
     
  16. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    I like that. From what are the clips taken? (Most of them prove my point, though. Just because they 'cut' and 'kill' doesn't mean they're really great for everything)

    "Let's line up some pig carcasses and test it out!"
     
  17. wchnu

    wchnu Duck Season!

    LOve the clips. Forged in fire is a good show.
     
  18. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    I'd never heard of the show before. Just watched an episode involving deer horn knives. Fun, I'll have to hunt up more episodes on YouTube.
     
  19. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    So far with my OLD, I've used GSB and am at the mid point of my Shark audition. So far either blade would work. But I've got Voskhod, PolSilver and Rapira Platinum Lux I really want to try. Then I will make a bulk purchase of the winner
     
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  20. RetLEO-07

    RetLEO-07 likes his penguin deep fried, with pink sparkles

    This week's blade audition has come to an end. So far the GSB is holding its own. The Shark delivered some excellent shaves, but there was a drop off yesterday & today
     
    Bama Samurai likes this.

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