I had a chance last night to put this new Apache to work on a razor that was a bit harsh (one of my C-Mons) on the face. I used the DMT to lap the Apache first. Any slurry raised in the process (relatively little) was rinsed off. I did a series of circles and X-strokes (approximately 35-50 strokes each) with just water; no slurry. Good audible feedback and a nice tactile feel from the stone. Stropped line & leather; shave. Very keen edge (still), but very comfortable. It was only a 2-pass shave, but overall, very enjoyable with none of the harshness from the edge I had felt before using this razor. So my initial foray with this stone was promising.
I have the same feeling about mine, I will be buying a bigger dark one as soon as he post one I like the looks of. thought about having him cut me one but I would like to see what it looks like, if I buy one now he will post one I like the looks of better.
well, here we go again he just put up a new stone a red apache, says it may be a bevel setter. either way a beautiful stone.
So the Apache Red is now being referred to as not necessarily a bevel-setter, but an actual 'pre-finisher'?
no it is a definite finisher , could be used as a prefinisher but it is according to bayamontate as a finisher and he sure knows his hones. there is now a forum on the site now as well, terry is just getting it up and running.
yes , but look at the stone after its lapped and polished though, he has a pic of two finished out on the apache red portion of the site. I will admit I was in doubt about the strata and I own 4 of them now. if the red finishes as well it will be a definite keeper. I think that pic is the 2 pounder. h Terry was spot on on the strata. I finish off a coti on the strata and the shave is outstanding. in the end we are all chasing the quality of the shave, not the ability of hht's or arm hair but the shave quality, are we not?
I have a couple of the strata, but am not sure why I would need the Red, unless it supplants the Norton 8k. Currently my sequence is: Chosera 1k>Norton4k>Norton8k>Apache Strata or Escher finisher. I would like to think so, but the more threads I read on shave honing forums, the more the focus seems to be on the process rather than the results (a smooth shave). Hence, the plethora of honing materials (stones—nats & synthetics, films, etc), prescribed sequences, 8-10 stones from bevel-setting to finisher....
I still have a hard time believing that back in the 1700-1800's the average Joe used all or had this many stones to maintain his shavers...pre-finisher is that like pre-dead...just saying Take care.
The Escher is claimed to be anywhere in the 12k-15k range; mine being a dark blue, probably closer to 12k…but who really knows? The Apache strata's site states somewhere between 10-12k….
They probably didn't…and they also made do without indoor plumbing nor electricity. I'm fairly certain, just as with the other additional developments available to us today, they would have been happy to adapt, given the opportunity.
Once upon a time the average Joe and the average barber did not have all theses hones. People lived very close to the line in those days. There was a guy referred to as a grinder that would set bevels on knives and razors and scissors and garden shear. All the man did was return fine tools to a proper edge. Barbers and even the people who could afford to have their own razors just maintained the edges for the most part. The heavy work was farmed out.
I received my Red today. A razors on deck for tomorrows shave. I don't want to put my foot in mouth quite yet but I have a good feeling about this rock.
Ok so gentlemen pre-finisher stone...sounds like we are splitting hairs instead of shaving whiskers so if you have a 12k and 20k would the pre-finisher be the 12k? or is it just another stone in progressive honing....all in the name of chasing a keener edge...boy I still have a lot to learn.
i consider a pre-finisher any stone (usually under 8k) used before a finishing stone. An 8k was at one time considered a finisher (i.e. you could shave off it).
I'm shaving off of the Norton 8K with no complaints at all. I recently made a balsawood bench strop for some CromOx paste, an while it was fun to see such a simple and inexpensive material work so well as a medium for holding the paste, I don't know that the edges are truly any more comfortable coming of the balsa, and I doubt they're any "sharper" or keener either. It doesn't seem to make them any less comfortable though. At the moment I think I get more practical improvement in the edge's comfort from the stropping on the hanging linen/leather than I do from the CromOx. I haven't yet had any SR long enough for the edge to get worn to the point of needing a "touch-up", but I'm hoping that the CromOx bench strop might do some work in that respect as well. I don't foresee replacing the 8K finisher with a 12K or 20K anytime soon.
