Any Strop Questions?

Discussion in 'Straight Razors' started by ShavedZombie, Sep 30, 2010.

  1. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    So, I've tried this on another forum with pretty good results, so I figured I'd try it here... I don't have much to keep me busy on campus, and this forum is fairly slow and quiet, so why not try to liven things up?

    Okay, so, Here's some background for you (Short version, skip to paragraph 4):

    I'm a straight razor only guy. The only time I've ever touched DEs was to buff them, or clean them, and then resell them. I've been into restoration and honing for several months now, and I've been using straight razors for a little over a year.

    In that time, I've gotten the opportunity to study under some really great guys in the straight razor community. I'm not going to say my honing is perfect, or that my restorations scale mountains, but I'm commercial-grade good at both. I can produce almost full mirror finishes and hone to smooth shave-ness, even if I can't rival Lynn, Glen, and the other big names.

    However, my real passion, for some unknown reason, is strops! I love stropping, and I love strops. I have somewhere around 11-14 strops (more or less depending on how you count the modular paddle), a few I've made, most I've bought, and I still have one or two more in the mail coming to me. Along with all the strops I've owned and experimented with, I've also had a chance to use other guy's strops (Specifically Lynn, as he lived near me for a while) and I've gotten a very broad knowledge of all kinds of different leathers and stropping surfaces, Vintage and new production, from many of God's beasts. I've also spent a more-than-healthy amount of time reviving vintage strops, altering strop draw, etc, so I've got a few tricks up my sleeves.

    All that being said (sorry for boring you ) I can't help but notice that the straight razor forum is, for the most part, a ghost town, especially where strop threads are involved. So, I wanted to throw my, albeit still budding, experience into the ring. I've asked hundreds, maybe thousands, of stupid questions while I was learning. So, if you have any strop related questions (even ones you think are stupid or obvious); width, length, thickness, materials, hangers, handles, etc, Post them here! I want to help, and I want something to keep me occupied.

    Fingers crossed that this post sounds like I'm trying to help, rather than be an egocentric jackass :happy102

    Best Regards,
    Jeremy
     
  2. Reformation Student

    Reformation Student New Member

    Great idea, Jeremy! I'll post a couple of questions for you to chew on:

    Over the past weekend, I traveled and brought along my 4 sided paddle strop from Tony Miller. I only used the plain leather as the razor didn't need sharpening on the paste (which I don't use anymore). It had tremendous draw and the edge comfort was remarkable. I know the amount of draw is supposed to be irrelevant but that wasn't my experience. Coming home, I went back to my recently restored TM red latigo (restored thanks to your advice) and it had significantly less draw (still had it, but much less than the paddle) and the edge comfort reflected that.

    How do I increase the draw even more on the latigo hanging strop? Would I use a lower grit of sandpaper than the 2k that I finished up on? I know you mentioned I could play around with that to effect the finish of the strop (smooth vs. "fuzzy") but would it also effect the draw?

    Secondly, if I wanted to purchase a new strop that had massive draw, what are your recommendations?

    Seems that I am developing a likeness for real heavy draw on my strops for some reason and it's a subject that's beginning to pique my interest now.

    Thanks for offering for us pick your brain :D
     
  3. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    Thanks for biting! An easy way to increase draw is with Neatsfoot Oil (you can get it from a lot of places, I got mine from SRD, if I remember correctly). A little bit goes a long way. Just but a dab of it in your palm, and rub that evenly across the strop surface. Let it dry overnight then try the strop out (Make sure you rub the strop till it's warm with your untreated palm before stropping. That alone adds draw). Keep neatsfooting the strop until you're happy with it.

    You could do a little work with sandpaper, but that is mostly for finetuning, if you really want to amp up the draw, neatsfoot is your best bet.

    As for a production run strop with high draw, that would DEFINITELY be SRD's Premium 3. The Buffalo hide has more draw than anything else I've used. However, Neil Miller (a shop in the UK) sells a line of "Juchten leather" strops (at least, that's what I remember them being called... It's been a while) and those have high draw too.

    Cheers,
    Jeremy
     
  4. Reformation Student

    Reformation Student New Member

    Great, thanks for the suggestions. I've heard about the Premium 3. It looks like a great strop (actually all the SRD strops look great). Are there any brands of neatsfoot oil to stay away from or will any brand be OK?
     
  5. 8thsinner

    8thsinner New Member

    I have a couple for you.

    But I suggest you start with a few definations in your opinion on how to judge things.
    What is draw?
    How would you measure it?
    Are different draws recommended for different levels of stropping?
    For example a roo hide with low draw, is it best used with a .5 micron mix, or something bigger, etc for polishing or maintenance or even shaping?

    You have already mentioned how to change it to great effect. so I won't ask about that.

    If you wanted a strop very much on the cheap for example by recycling old leather belts from charity shops what should people look for?

    For a survivalist on the move nice and light through multiple terrains requiring the ability to touch up several different blades, from an axe toa straight razor what strop set up would you recommend? What hide, What pastes?, pastes or not? for multi purpose use? Two skins stitched together in professionally grooved stitch lines? etc etc

    An excellent sharpening set up was recently selling on a wilderness forum I frequent concocting a 2000, 6000 grit japanese stone combo 6"x1/5" I think, wrapped in a strop with a nagura block as a handle hold. How would you view this set up?

    Can youput together a list of different types of hides and what they may be best for.
    For example, Bridle leather versus chap leather?
     
  6. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    I haven't experimented with different brands of Neatsfoot, so I can't answer there... However, I can tell you that anything from SRD will work well, so if you buy their premium III, just toss a small bottle of neatsfoot in the order too

    Too me, Draw is the resistance I feel on the blade as I strop, how "sticky" the strop feels when it grabs the blade.

    I measure draw with superposition, which is to say I don't rank it on a scale of 1-10, or anythign like that, I look at it as "more or less draw than [insert strop here]". I also say high draw to refer to a lot of the sticky sensation and low draw to refer to a strop that doesn't grab the blade at all.

    What you're hinting at with different draws and strops is something I call "Strop progression". It's very similar to a hone progression, only minutely noticeable... Some people say it plays no role at all in the level of comfort of the shave... I, however, think that you can, to a small degree, make a shave more comfortable by progressing from high draw to low draw... I do it with linen components to. An example: I go from TM Linen to TM Nylon to TM Latigo to TM Horsehide... Also, and this is my personal experience so YMMV, If a razor has been out of rotation for a while, I generally use a higher draw strop for it, whereas if it's freshly honed or recently stropped, I'll go straight to the low draw strop. When it comes to paste, I never apply paste to leather as, in my opinion, leather keeps the abrasives right on the surface, and can micro-scratch the edge. I always use linen components, Wool Felt being my favorite, as they minutely conceal the abrasion, making it a less agressive process

    If you wanted a strop in the cheap, I'd say don't use a belt (There are a few horror stories of this on other forums where people have absolutely destroyed their edges.) I'd say buy a Filly, or any other maker that provides cheap "entry" strops. However, if you must go the belt route, make sure the belt has NO ornamentation, and is pure, smooth leather... Then start at 200grit with sand paper and progress up to 1500. I recommend, if you wish to go this route, a weight lifting belt, for the width, and purity of leather.

    I'm not sure what you mean with the survivalist bit... I don't think I would strop an axe, just use a whetstone... However, for travel, I recommend paddle strops... specifically (Man, I'm giving them a lot of plugs :p ) SRD's modular paddle. Simply because you can pick any leather for any occassion (along with pasted felts... I personally prefer .5 micron pastes, diamond spray or chromium oxide crayon) and swap them out on the fly.

    I'm not quite sure what to make of that sharpenign setup... However, if it ends at 6000 grit, it's not enough for most people... The general "commercially honed" minimum is 8000, with most people preferring 12000 or more. As for the strop, I'd have to see it to tell you... Sorry.

    To be honest, Almost every strop leather is good, It's just personal preference for the most part... High draw, low draw, width, handles, etc. As far as different applications, I'd say if you want to do a rotation just use a high draw strop (english bridle, Latigo, Bufallo, etc) followed by low draw (Horsehide, Cordovan, Shell, Premium I). Although I've used very low draw strops for day-to-day stroppping... It really isn't one of those "Every strop serves a unique purpose" scenarios, so much as a "variety is the spice of life" one.

    Cheers,
    Jeremy
     
  7. 8thsinner

    8thsinner New Member

    I will say on the note on axes, that you may not strop a regular axe, but high end axe like gransfors brux greatly benefits from a stropping daily as does any other blade in camp use. They are honed razor sharp and a smoother polish reduces sticking in wood.

    On the strop used in the kit that I saw, I don't know what it was. But lets assume that only one strop is going to be carried, would you recommend a buffalo then?

    The 6000 if only one high stone was used, I thought would be okay for both knives and razor, at least for me, I can get a shave from a 4000k and a pasted strop with jewellers rouge.
    If I added a third stone, would a better selection then be 1000, 6000, 12,000, with an unpasted strop.

    Survivalist when I say it btw, means literally pocket sized, if your saying the best way is to use a solid backed strop, we do that by splitting with an axe, trimming with a camp knife and finishing smoothing with a carpenters scraper. then pin the strop some how to this.
     
  8. 8thsinner

    8thsinner New Member

    Oh, additional question.
    Have you tried heavily greased strops, I mean perhaps some veg tanned briddle leather thats been well looked after in the stable? How do they perform if at all?
     
  9. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    I've used Extremely waxy/greasy latigo... It doesn't perform as well as clean leather. Too much surface refuse in the way.

    You can get a decent shave off of the 4-5k level, but it's just decent. A pasted strop helps greatly.

    If you want one leather for all those tools than I'd recommend Buffalo or Latigo for the higher draw. As for the stone, I'd say, in that situation, a 1k, incase any of the tools got dinged and needed chips removed...

    However I don't really consider straight shaving a "survivalist" activity... I'd opt for a DE razor in those situations for portability, and it won't require as much maintenance
     
  10. DrDead

    DrDead Member

    Hello jeremy , I have a question for you. I have a vintage strop with a crease in the middle of it. It was folded in half and stored in a box for 30 years. I've hung it up and put it in the sun but the crease is still there. I don't want to ruin it by leaving by leaving it in the sun. Any suggestions ?
     
  11. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    First of all, which way was the strop folded? The direction of the crease is important, was it folded with the strop surface out, or strop surface in?
     
  12. DrDead

    DrDead Member

    Strop surface out. Its not much of a crease anymore , it bows slightly when I strop. I was wondering if there is a way to re condition it to make it more flexible.
     
  13. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    To make it more flexible, you'd want to use Neatsfoot oil on it... However, to remove the remenants of the crease, I would recommend sanding the strop.

    Start at 200 grit and sand until the crease is gone, then progress 200- 400 - 800 - 1000 - 1500... At every grit after 400 (8-15) test-strop on the leather until you find the finish that suits you (some people prefer all the way at 1500, an extremely smooth, glossy surface, and some prefer around 800, a bit more tactile)

    That's what I'd do at least.

    Cheers,
    Jeremy
     
  14. saf

    saf Member

    I am new to this and have a few minor "marks" that I made in my strop practicing. They are not chunks but some light lines across and just chips on the edges. Is it hurting my blade? I bought a replacement leather for the strop but I don't really want to change it yet.
     
  15. DrDead

    DrDead Member

    Thanks for your help. I'll try that.
     
  16. ShavedZombie

    ShavedZombie Member

    SAF, The tiny flicks out of the edge don't really damage your stropping, don't worry about them

    However, if you want to get rid of them, 1500 grit sand paper will remove the marks without altering the strop (except for the color lightening slightly)
     
  17. hoglahoo

    hoglahoo Yesterday's News

    Why does stropping improve the effectiveness of the razor being stropped? I know it works but am curious why
     
  18. Dslazar9

    Dslazar9 Took the Menthol-cratic Oath

    ShavedZombie, thanks I appreciate the offer. My questions are pretty basic as I've been using a str8 for only a few months. I found a Strop at an antique store and am interested in what the 4 sides are for and if you've ever heard of my particular strop.

    It says "Stoddard 874 Washington St. Boston, Mass. 259. The brown sided says "Sharpen" and "Genuine Shell." The black side says "Finish."
    I recognize the brown side is more appropriate for a duller blade but I'm wondering if the back sides of them are used for anything. Both back sides have a rougher feel but are still pretty smooth.

    Thanks again.
     
  19. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Eccentric Razor Collector Staff Member

    Moderator Article Team
    I've been thinking about making a DIY strop, and was wondering if harness leather or AA grade shoe sole leather would work? Great thread! Keep up the good work.
     
  20. Reformation Student

    Reformation Student New Member

    Jeremy,

    Thanks for the neatsfoot idea. About 5 or 6 applications and I have the heavy draw I want on the strop. Works great. The only drawback is that it darkened my nice red leather but that's OK. I prefer the draw to the color.

    I wonder how often I'll need to repeat the application of the oil. Should it be a one time deal or will I need to reapply every few months?

    Thanks again for the great advice.
     

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