Modern Machined Stainless Steel Adjustable Toggle

Discussion in 'Safety Razors' started by blashe, Feb 25, 2018.

  1. HolyRollah

    HolyRollah BaconLord Staff Member

    Nice razor.
    I'll never be in the market for one, but that doesn't diminish my appreciation of the efforts put forth to bring this model to life.
    Keithmax, Bookworm and Str8on2 like this.
  2. RaZorBurn123

    RaZorBurn123 waiting hardily...............

    Very interesting. This could be a major game changER
    Wow! Thanks for the link.
  3. Rhody

    Rhody Well-Known Member

    If that was a problem originally I wonder if he knew that or could work around it .it would seem straightforward to reverse engineer the original .but if the original had a flaw Luke tiu guys are saying,,,well then .
    jar likes this.
  4. DaltonGang

    DaltonGang Ol' Itchy Whiskers

    Hopefully all the door issues isn't an inherent design flaw. I know the guy attempting to reproduce his own version of the "Gillette Toggle Razor" is an engineer. But, as big as Gillette was, don't you think they had several engineers working to fix that same problem??? They gave up, and went to produce the Gillette 195 Adjustable. That said, I hope this guy figure the issues out, and it goes into production, at a reasonable price.
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  5. blashe

    blashe Well-Known Member

    He might be able to fix the issues but who knows, considering all the tech advancement we have today he has way more tools as designer at his disposal to work on trail errors. As far as price goes the razor has 36 pieces in total of which 18 are machined from 316L SS in the USA, I have a feeling somewhere 500-600 price tag but then there are people who think somewhere between 300-450... One thing I know for sure it will NOT be less than 300 if you look logical at the info he has given us for the razor.
    Keithmax likes this.
  6. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    They could have had too many different engineers. The issue is that when you use a 'toggle' mechanism like that, it requires tension to lock the toggle in either position. Most products I've worked with (not a lot, admittedly, but several) used a heavy spring to 'lock' the toggle so it couldn't move. I think that Gillette was trying to use the blade itself to be the spring. However, that requires a very stiff blade to be a leaf spring - i.e. the _original_ blades from the teens and 20's. Later ones weren't as stiff, as we all know from personal use.

    So, you pull the toggle -it goes over a 'hump', which puts the maximum amount of tension on the doors. Then, it drops into place - probably a flat spot or mild socket - and _releases_ a bit of tension to hold itself in place. (Basically, it moves up slightly) By doing that - it's lost the maximum tension that a later Adjustable managed.

    By going to the screw mechanism - a very simple one - you simply tighten until you've reached what you want.

    If I remember correctly, many of the quick release pins for bicycles use a similar technique, except in reverse. Pull straight, and the tension is gone. Fold down and it locks the wheel in place. If Gillette had done _that_, it would have worked well - but looked rather visually disturbing.

    The only way I can think to simply (maybe not easily) fix this would be to add a heavy spring of some sort beneath the base plate.
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  7. blashe

    blashe Well-Known Member

  8. kingfisher

    kingfisher Active Member

    They didn't "give up." They sent the razors out to testers and sent prototypes of the 195 out, as well. The feedback was that the majority of beta-testers preferred the 195, so they moved in that direction.
    If the majority had preferred the Toggle mechanism, the engineers would have found a way to make it work. What was the point, though, when users preferred the 195? Maybe I'm being nit-picky, but to me "giving up" is not the same thing as moving to what the market preferred.
    Keithmax, RyX, LOOT and 2 others like this.
  9. Jim99

    Jim99 Gold Water Shaver

    That sounds very logical.
    RyX and LOOT like this.
  10. jar

    jar Well-Known Member

    Or combine the two processes, toggle to open or close then turn to lock in place using a threaded mechanism. Rube cudda handled it.
    RyX, LOOT and Bookworm like this.
  11. Shave7

    Shave7 Active Member

    It will never come to fruition.

    Not enough demand and the cost will be too high. Companies are in business for one reason: to make money!
  12. Keithmax

    Keithmax Breeds Pet Rocks

    I am with you guys, I probably will never buy it but I hope he succeeds. Either way it is a cool project and so far I like what I see.
    Rhody and RyX like this.
  13. blashe

    blashe Well-Known Member

    From what I can see the guy has been paying out of his pocket for machining R&D while he is working on the design aspects. Considering how far he has come it looks to me that the razor will come to fruition, question is what sort of availability are we talking about? Well considering that the razor has 18 machined pieces then it will be on high end on the price, probably price tag around $350 - $550. We know by now razors of that high of a price tag how they sell, take a look at Rocnel Sailor,Paradigm Ti etc, they come out 2-3 times a year in small numbers.
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2018
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  14. Rhody

    Rhody Well-Known Member

    I hope its not up that high
  15. LOOT

    LOOT Well-Known Member

    While I am a HUGE Toggle fan and still own 3, I've seen the insides of a freshly replated Toggle that was used for 3 months, by me. I'm kinda anal at keeping them clean. Even so, the insides of a Toggle are impossible to clean. They are magnets for soap scum and hair. I applaud the Janus for reviving a legend, but I'm so out. I am no longer interested in any razor that is not user serviceable. At least that's my stance today. The price of the Janus could change my mind, but I doubt it.
    Keithmax and RyX like this.
  16. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    Tried an ultrasonic cleaner? It won't necessarily get everything, but they do a good job at popping loose crud in small crevices.
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  17. LOOT

    LOOT Well-Known Member

    No sir. No ultrasonic. It would be interesting to see just how clean it could get the inside of a Gillette adjustable though. If you have one and can disassemble a razor, send pics.
    Keithmax, PickledNorthern and RyX like this.
  18. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    I sent one that had originally been really caked with soap to @Tiredricefarmer, and combined with soaking, it managed to remove who knows how many years of soap that had actually eaten a lot of the plating. It went from totally unadjustable to smooth functioning.

    It's not a panacea, but the UC really does help get rid of crap.

    I have a 40's SS that had a loose clamp on the TTO knob, and once I removed that, the UC did manage to force some algae/mildew/soap to release from the inside of the barrel. . I meant to take photos, but didn't have the camera around, and by the time I did -the pieces had dried up and started powdering.

    I'll see if another of my Slims wants to be dismantled.
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  19. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I wouldn’t bring your beautiful Toggles within ten feet of an ultrasonic. I think they are great, and use one myself, but they can also be had on black paint and red dots. And while I figure you have the best possible plating jobs available, if there did happen to be a void in it anywhere, those little ultrasonic bubbles like to eat at them.
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  20. Bookworm

    Bookworm Well-Known Member

    I found that with my red tip - it's the soak that went after the paint, not the ultrasonic. The ultrasonic will just take advantage of it. One razor, after a soaking, the toothbrush was stripping off all the paint. On the other hand, I have a slim that sat in the ultrasonic for probably half an hour of vibrating, and three days of soaking, and the dot paint stayed intact. So it's a crap shoot - but aren't they all, on 50+ year old razors?

    I will admit that some ultrasonic cleaners are strong enough to work at the pits and cracks in plating; I don't believe my HF branded cleaner will do it :)
    LOOT and Keithmax like this.

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