Rockwell Model T

Discussion in 'Safety Razors' started by Sabre, Mar 16, 2018.

  1. blashe

    blashe Well-Known Member

    Looks like these early T-bar pieces where the T part is zinc and the rod is zamac are not attached to each other via threading but instead with some sort of lock tight but it seems to fail. The new Tbar and rod will be one piece and it will be all zamac, at least this should fix the separation problem if the sizing is matched for fitment
     
  2. DesertTime

    DesertTime Well-Known Member

    They seem especially proud of the plastic trays for shipping the new T-Bars. At this point, they need to take wins wherever they can get them.
    I find it curious they always refer backers to the updates for detailed information about shipping schedules. And not a single update has shipping/distribution details.
    And those rave reviews keep pouring in. You'll find them right next to the shipping details.
     
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  3. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Paperboy

    Article Team
    Lol.

    I was thinking along similar lines. I guess the store was out of bubble wrap and Scotch tape?
     
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  4. DesertTime

    DesertTime Well-Known Member

    Those still waiting will like this. A very current review, published today, I think. I'm not familiar with the reviewer, but he's clearly impressed.
    Warning, it's a very long video, which includes a long unboxing and a shave. Enjoy.

     
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  5. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Paperboy

    Article Team
    If I shaved like he does, I would have agonizing razorburn and ingrown hairs. Halfway through his shave I wondered why he bothered with lather in the first place.

    For my own amusement, I imagined him talking about a Gillette Fatboy. His midshave facturbation was funny as well, since I remember doing that when I first started wetshaving.

    All in all, a good review. I would have liked to see a few more comparisons to other razors to give viewers more of a baseline.
     
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  6. DesertTime

    DesertTime Well-Known Member

    I noticed that as well. He did 15 passes, but lathered once. What he lacked in technique he made up for in enthusiasm.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2018
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  7. Spang

    Spang Member

    I'm not as effusive in my praise of the Model T as this gentleman, but I do like it so far. I'm a few shaves in and it does deliver a very nice shave for me. I'm less enamored of the build quality. The tolerances are excellent and the workings very smooth, but the head is clearly of all cast parts. I'm not sure of the material; some form of zinc alloy (aka zamak) I assume. I'm not sure about the internals, but you can see mold marks on the plate and on the thrust mechanism, so these are clearly cast. The castings appear to be very well done, but still. Also, I (along with anyone else who has so far gotten a Model T) have the two piece T-bar. I inquired about this on the Rockwell KS page and got back a fairly sharply worded response assuring me that the reported failure of this part was a one-off deal and nothing to worry about. Still, it seems like an inherently flawed concept to me to have such a structurally integral part that consists of two pieces joined, which by definition introduces a potential fail point. They said they'd make it good if there is a problem, but I'd prefer to not have one in the first place.

    We'll see how it holds up over time, but for now I'll restate my opinion that this razor may be a very hard sell at $195.
     
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  8. blashe

    blashe Well-Known Member

    It will be a very hard sell at $195 considering the razor at its current state is around 75% all zinc
     
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  9. DanielB

    DanielB Member

    I think $195 (US) is a temporary and phony price hike, done only to add a sense of extra value for Kickstarter & Indiegogo backers (look what a great deal you're getting!) and to stem the flow of refund requests from those who were doing so with the expectation that they might later buy the regular production razor, once proven to be a worthwhile purchase, for maybe $10-25 more than they'd backed at. (Yes, they'd be passing up the free 100 Rockwell blades offered on both platforms, and if a KS backer also the $2 bladebank and $5 leather razor sheath freebie addons - no great loss).

    Heck, in early April, Rockwell announced that they'd "drastically underestimated the costs" involved in Model T production and as such the T's regular price would much higher than anticipated, yet they STILL gave anyone who wanted one (backers or general public) an extra month to buy in via preorder on their own site for $99 (same as on IGG since it started there). And in their typical manner, that message was delivered with enthusiasm. Backers on both platforms should have taken that as a huge slap in the face; were I a $94 or $99 backer and not the $79 KS UltraEarlyBird-er that I am, I'd have jumped ship right then.

    Anyhow, even if the T ends up getting rave reviews from a majority of backers, it's a mostly zamac razor and $195 is impossible to justify versus the competition — including Rockwell's own multi-plate "adjustables", the stainless-steel 6S @ $100 and chromed-alloy 6C @ just $50. You could buy three Merkur Progress (a true adjustable, also made of zamac) for $195, with change left over. So I foresee only rich fools who don't know any better dropping $195 on a mostly zinc Model T. Sales at that price will be few and far between.

    If priced more reasonably from the start of regular production —say at or around the same price as a 6S— then the T could sell like hotcakes ("premium stainlesss steel plate-based adjustable razor or fully adjustable zinc-alloy razor, your choice, same price"). And if the Model T was priced around $100, Rockwell's lifetime warranty and proven track record with no-hassle replacements may justify the price difference over a Progress, Parthenon or vintage adjustable.

    So I say $195 regular price is unrealistic, unreasonable, and unlikely. Regardless of reviews, that price will drop. And when it does, I fully expect it will be announced with Rockwell's standard proud bubbly spin.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2018
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  10. brit

    brit Well-Known Member

    i love the vintage gillettes . i would like to purchase a new top end razor at some point in my life. does this razor or the rex adjustable,parthenon or other offer a significantly better shave than an executive gold fatboy for example. just curious.not able to purchase all to compare.thank you, gary.this may be a naive question to some but what i buy is what i am stuck with..
     
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  11. Jim Bennett

    Jim Bennett Member

    Gillette is the razor by which all other razors are judged. I don't (and will never) have a Model T but I've tried a slew of others and I haven't found any razor that is superior or even equal to a Fatboy. The problem is that Fatboys aren't made any more and there is a limited supply of prime condition pre-owned razors. If you have one and it breaks you can't go to Amazon and have it replaced in two days. I think people are looking for Gillette substitutes in these razors. None of them make the grade.
     
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  12. jmudrick

    jmudrick Well-Known Member

    A bit much Jim. There are apparently many Rex Ambassador owners who would take issue. Not to mention vintage Gibbs and Apollo owners. Not to mention myriad owners of razors who see little value in an adjustable to begin with with their inherent compromises and complexity. I shaved with a Slim yesterday and it was a fine shave but it didn't make me want to sell my Apollos.
     
  13. brit

    brit Well-Known Member

    i enjoy my british aristocrats more than the fatboy.i am sure i would enjoy many other new razors as well.
     
  14. Spang

    Spang Member

    Yes. This seemed like not only an effort to stem the rush to the exits, but also a ploy to raise cash by soliciting more pledges. It makes one wonder where the more than 620K raised through KS and IGG went, and if perhaps there were (are?) cash flow problems associated with all of the delays in production? You do have to pay your suppliers and subs to get product.
    I agree. My Model T is an excellent shaver; in fact about the equal of my $50 6C. Or, about as good, shave-wise, as my Razorock Game Changer, which is CNC machined 316L with perfect fit and finish, and also $50.
     
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  15. oldjoe

    oldjoe Active Member

    After seeing the Red Loctite comment and hearing from Rockwell I decided to try and see if I could get the Model T back to shaving condition on my own whilst I wait for Rockwell to replace my "broken" razor when the solid T-bar becomes available. I watched the U-tube disassembly of the Model T razor and it is quite simple to take it apart. The T-bar on my razor appears to be a brass rod with a Zamac?chromed door assembly. I didn't take a file to the metal to see what it was like under the chrome plating? I used a very small amount of super glue after I figured out how far the T-bar has to be inserted on the brass rod to make the doors close properly. Done waited a day And, I have now begun shaving with the self repaired Model T once again. 3 days so far And, it performs very nicely. The adjustment was and still is super smooth and it is easy for me to fine tune the agreeiveness for my face and the blade used. Still very smooth with everything after the repair but I am very being careful not to put any pressure at all on the final tightening so that the 2 piece assembly won't fall apart in the sink once again. How long it will hold together is questionable or maybe not and perhaps Red Loctite would work better or best but I have never had any experience with red loctite. The super glue is thin enough to allow the T-bar to be repositioned and stuck in the correct position though how long it will last in warm water exposure is possibly questionable. I have many razors including the old Gillette adjustables of all varieties along with most all of the 3 piece Gillettes. A few stainless steel razors along with one high priced brass and a couple of plastic and bakelite razors too. I also have the Rockwell stainless 3 piece razor. Because of how good I consider the Rockwell 3 piece stainless razor I wondered at the finished product their adjustable razor would become. The lifetime endurance and beyond idea doesn't worry me so much as at my age as I finally realize when you're here you're here and when you are not, I don't think you will give a fig. Maybe I ma wrong, but I think not? No one has ever come back to tell me how great all their decisions in life worked out after they were gone. So, the main purpose is to get a new razor that shaves ads good as any other I've tried. I think the model T has done that for me and the T-bar thing is/was just another disappointment in one of countless many of life's purchases. I'll continue to shave with my self repaired model T adjustable and I hope it lasts long enough till the replacement hits my door! And to Brit I say I enjoy my Gillette Diplomat and President razors equally as well as the Rockwell razors I own. I still have not found any one razor that for me is so powerfully great that I would want to shave with that one single razor each and every day. My father would say it's me cause he said long ago I seem to have all the problems with: just about everything! Tomorrow I don't know what razor I will shave with but I am thinking it might be the Medol T once again. And don't get me started on shaving brushes!!! With them I've found the perfect handle shape and hair knot that works best for me. Sometimes?
     
  16. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Paperboy

    Article Team
    Red locktite is enough of a binder that you only use it on things you don't ever want coming apart again. Takes a torch or very high powered heat gun to separate it after the fact.

    I used to use it to attach a spindle to the compressors for walk in freezers. Never heard of a failure...in that part at least.

    Blue loctite is what people use if they want something to come apart at a later date.

    Edit: when the super glue fails, scrape out as much of the remnants as you can with an xacto knife, then use red locktite.
     
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  17. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I’ve gotta tip the hat to you here. Gillette razors never were my thing. Tried a ton. Wanted to love them, cause I was told I should. I own one today. My birthday razor. I’m not a TTO fan overall, and other than the New, and the Pre War Tech, I just never really cared much for any of them.
     
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  18. oldjoe

    oldjoe Active Member

    Thanks Plan of Man, I will do that. Get some Red Loctite and have a go. Your advice reminds me of some advice I received long ago suggesting I use Kroil to loosen up a fine threaded screw that wouldn't unscrew and allow me to take apart something I wanted to repair. It worked when nothing else I tried did and without harming anything. And, that stuff was amazing. I have used Kroil on many old razors as well to loosen up the works.
     
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  19. Zed117

    Zed117 Active Member

    I've been watching the model t since I got my 6s back in January. Due to all the changes and most recent set backs, I've decided to do just that.
     
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  20. BBS

    BBS Well-Known Member

    I use PB blaster on seized razors. Works every time except for that smell. Sometimes it takes a day or so to full loosen but it always does assuming there isn't also mechanical problems. To remove that PB smell I use dawn soap and a hot bath something I would have done anyways with the razor.
     
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