Silvertips badger or HMB

Discussion in 'The Brush' started by CastleShave, May 5, 2018.

  1. CastleShave

    CastleShave Well-Known Member

    Can someone help me find a silvertips badger brush with decent backbone. I love the texture of the badger but they are way to look floppy and splay out too easily. Lmk

    Sent from my SM-T377W using Tapatalk
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  2. Douglas Carey

    Douglas Carey Wildman

    I have found that a 2 Band set at a loft of 50mm has good backbone. YMMV.
  3. david of central florida

    david of central florida Rhubarb Rubber

    20180428_205414_resized.jpg The whipped dog silvertip set deep is firmer.
    Larry will build for you if you contract him.
    Mine is set 5mm deeper than norm.
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  4. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I have pretty much always been a firm believer that if you want traditional three band silvertip , you have to step it up a notch in your price point. I am not really a big fan of just shoving a knot deeper down a handle to get backbone. You stiffen it up sure, but you are hampering the characteristics of the hair, so to speak. If you want that feel, buy a Finest from Stirling. They have as good of a quality/price/performance ratio as anything I have ever tried.

    So, to get a good silvertip , you need density to make a good brush. You want more hair, you need to pay more. You don’t have to go Thater, Kent or Simpson more, but IMO, you have to step it up a bit from entry level.

    If you want a good silvertip , at a lower cost entry, the Grade A knots from TGN can be purchased pretty inexpensively and plopped into the handle of your choice. Any of the Razorock offerings, silvertip or HMW, are sourced by Zenith, and are really good knots. Envy Shave’s Envy Supreme is a fantastic knot.

    There are some others out there of course, but these are all brushes I own, and can attest to their quality. My experience has just been that it’s better not to skimp when it comes to silvertip knots.
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  5. jar

    jar Well-Known Member

    But Simpson Super Badger or Thater Finest Silvertip will be hard to beat. I find the modern Kent Silvertip not quite as firm as the former. And when it comes to backbone but soft face feel I have not yet found anything better than Simpsons Chubbies.
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
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  6. PickledNorthern

    PickledNorthern Fabulous, the unicorn

    I would tend to agree with you on all points.
  7. PatrickA51

    PatrickA51 Well-Known Member

    What David of Central Florida said, I will have to agree with.
  8. CastleShave

    CastleShave Well-Known Member

    I thought I went the whole nine yards when I bought my Kent BLK12 but I’ll be honest I’m quite disappointed that my synthetic builds a better lather and feels better on the face. I feel like I’m not getting the joy that many others talk about.

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  9. CastleShave

    CastleShave Well-Known Member

    I want to take your word on this but I don’t want to spend $400+ and get disappointed again. The Kent has almost made me want to send it back because I don’t feel like it’s worth the hype. It was sold to me as the “rolls Royce of razors” I haven’t met many people that sit in the back of a rolls Royce and complain. So am I getting what this thing has to offer or is mine defected. I don’t know

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  10. jar

    jar Well-Known Member

    But you shouldn't take my word on that or anything else. That would be really silly. If you feel that a product is defective then certainly send it back but if you simply don't like a product I find that insufficient reason to send it back.

    Back as a child we all learned that if you did not like a particular dish you ordered or that was the family dinner, you certainly did not have to eat it. But you did not send food back that you ordered but didn't like. Your likes are your own likes. But a product is what it is. If the product was defective (well done steak when you asked for rare) then yes, send it back. If you decide you really don't like it rare, then next time order medium or well done.

    As a buyer, you should be wary of any claims including mine. You should understand that I am expressing my personal opinion and hopefully you will have your own opinion. But you then go one to mention $400.00. If you look there are quite a few Simpson Super Badger brushes available at quite a bit less than $400.00. Keep an eye open in the BST sections of the many shaving boards and it's likely you can even find some under $100.00 Simpson Super Badger brushes.

    And honestly, sitting in the back of a Rolls may be only slightly nicer than sitting in the drivers seat; they are nice but not exceptional from the performance point of view. Been there, done both.
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  11. SevenEighth

    SevenEighth Well-Known Member

    That's a lovely brush for face lathering with a high quality cream and held with forefingers and thumb supporting the loft. I find it builds lather like that more gently and faster than any other. Like burying you face in silk.

    Different cars for different uses. If you want the smoothest most luxurious ride, sit in the back of a Rolls. If you want to grip the road with a hard suspension and a fun fast ride around those hills outside Florence, drive an Italian coupé (e.g. a stiff Omega boar brush)

    I'm disappointed for you that you have an expensive brush that you don't like, I hope you find something you prefer.
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  12. jar

    jar Well-Known Member

    Today I used my Kent BLK8 (the 12 size is simply bigger than I like even in the H series) and it was wonderful; BUT, I also treated it differently than I would any of my synthetics. First since I was using a hard soap I began by putting some warm water on the soap to let it bloom. Next I put the hairs in some warm water to get the brush ready.

    Then I got me ready. Hair tied back in a pony tail so it's out of the way, face washed, teeth brushed, and only then shook the excess water out of the brush, poured the surface water from the soap in with the water in my basin and began making lather. It takes longer to make lather with badger than with a synthetic, takes more water and also more loading, but in about a minute I had more than enough really great lather for at least a three pass shave even though I almost never have to do more than two passes. BUT; I built the lather first and not just on my face.

    I did use my H12 four days ago and even though it is labeled Pure Badger it had about as soft a face feel as anything I own. I also used a cream with it and created the lather in a bowl.

    Badger, boar, horse and synthetic are all different and each requires a different routine but each can also produce a unique experience unlike the others. It comes down to what the individual likes; and likes at that time in his or her life.
    Last edited: May 10, 2018
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  13. gzp

    gzp Well-Known Member

    I've found that, just as with razors, technique can make a significant difference with brushes. Silvertip responds differently. Use a brush exclusively for a week or two and it starts to perform better.

    Maybe it was just craving the attention?
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  14. Douglas Carey

    Douglas Carey Wildman

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  15. CastleShave

    CastleShave Well-Known Member

    Not to worry I take all opinions provided and accept that those opinions are based on their expierence. I have a Kent BLK 4 as well and absolutely love that brush which is why I wanted to upgrade and get the blk12. But they do not feel alike. The blk4 is floppy but nice my blk12 feels scratchy and the hairs seem to be breaking. The floppyness is too much it's like it turns into a paddle when you have lather on it and smacks you in the face. Lol, judging by my BLK 4 I think maybe my brush might be defective as I don't have these problems with it. I assumed because the loft is almost triple the size this could be the reason for these changes but when the brushes are dry they feel very different as well. I think I'm going to write Kent an email and ask them about this. See what they say, I'm not going to send my brush to England only to risk being lost in the mail and/or take a month to go and come back to only see my same brush. I'll keep you guys posted on this and see what happens.

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  16. Linuxguile

    Linuxguile dating an unusual aristocrat

    Supporting Vendor
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  17. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Paperboy

    Article Team
    Well, first, you have to understand that "high mountain aka Manchurian" badger is a nothing phrase, absolutely meaningless. First, I'll explain what it could and should mean, and then what it actually means in terms of brush company production.

    High mountain white, Manchurian, or high mountain can refer to either a small section of hair from the meles meles (Eurasian) badger, about 10% of the silvertip hair from that badger that is longer and thicker than regular silvertip hair. (Since silvertip hair comprises about 10% of the available hair on a badger, this means only 1% of the total hair is "high mountain." Alternatively, it can refer to silvertip hair gathered from another type of badger, the hog badger.

    What I've seen in actual practice: a company gets in a batch of brushes from China that shows exceptional thickness, stiffness and/or quality. Company arbitrarily calls this batch "high mountain," raises the price, and makes a lot of money. (Edit: I've seen a remarkable variety of knots called high mountain badger, with nothing in common between them)

    If you want a badger brush with lots of backbone, get a two-band (finest) badger brush. This is a three band silvertip knot that has been set deeply enough to cover the third band.

    Edit: Ironically, the two companies that produce something I would consider a "high mountain" bager knot, call it nothing of the sort. That would be Shavemac's D01 two-band series of knots, and Simpson's Manchurian knots.
    Last edited: May 9, 2018
  18. SpeedyPC

    SpeedyPC Well-Known Member

    Did someone rang me ;) I'm very happy buying Maseto badger brushes because you don't have to spend a lot of money on very high-quality brushes from Paladin, Shavemac, Simpson, Thather or any other brand that you don't really need to spend a lot of money for one brush?

    I can buy at least two 30mm Maseto badger brushes for almost the same price for one high-quality badger brush from Paladin, Shavemac, Simpson, Thater or any other brand, you can buy at least 4 Whipped Dog 24mm High Mountain with a tall resin handle for the price of one high-quality brushes and they all do a fantastic job either face or bowl lather of your choice. You really have to ask yourself this question, do you really want to spend a lot of money for one high-quality brushes from Paladin, Shavemac, Simpson, Thater or any other brand online.

    Stop wasting money on higher range quality badger brushes, trust me is not worth it for face or bowl lather. Nothing wrong with Maseto, Semogue SOC 2 Band and Whipped Dog or any other badger brushes on the market just keep on looking.

    These pictures below I have in my den and I'm very happy and I don't have to spent a lot of money on high-quality badger brushes.

    Last edited: May 10, 2018
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  19. PLANofMAN

    PLANofMAN Paperboy

    Article Team
    ^^^...and that is the real question.

    I have low and high end brushes, and the quality difference between the two is about 10%...and the price difference is about $200.
  20. Keithmax

    Keithmax Breeds Pet Rocks

    My Blk12 is not scratch all and the hairs do not break. Sounds defective to me. Mine is a giant pillow.

    I’m curious to hear Kent’s reply..

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